18:04:53 <moray> #startmeeting DebConf12 meeting
18:04:53 <MeetBot> Meeting started Tue May 22 18:04:53 2012 UTC.  The chair is moray. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:04:53 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
18:05:01 * gaudenz prefers temparatures below 25°
18:05:07 <moray> #topic Final numbers for sponsored food/accomodation
18:05:34 <moray> http://munin.debconf.org/debconf.org/skinner.debconf.org.html#Pentabarf
18:06:19 <gwolf> FWIW, as of May 17 onwards, nobody who was in a non-sponsored category can select to be moved to a sponsored category
18:06:22 <h01ger> so now $someone needs to go through these accounts and check if they are legit
18:06:26 <cate> 214.45 partecipants
18:07:17 <gwolf> so, yes, unless somebody bribes me right, we have a maximum of 126+11 accomodation sponsorees and 126+22 food sponsorees
18:07:29 <moray> right
18:07:38 <moray> it would be sensible to get real numbers from the other field
18:07:53 <moray> and, as I said by email, probably to zap the different split "basic" statuses, which don't make sense
18:08:14 <gwolf> moray: it has been argued for and against them many times already
18:08:19 <gwolf> lets use them this time around
18:08:23 <moray> and to send status emails -- it's now late for it, but better now than later
18:08:35 <moray> gwolf: we also have another field though, which may contradict it :/
18:08:38 <gwolf> I know
18:09:25 <h01ger> reconfirmations now or later?
18:09:35 <gwolf> do you remember what field was the conflicting one?
18:09:46 <gwolf> (to build now a query and give us numbers on the contradictions)
18:09:49 <moray> gwolf: I don't know the penta internals, no.
18:10:02 * gwolf starts looking it up
18:10:07 <moray> if I had the right access/time I would have dealt with it before myself
18:10:17 <moray> unfortunately I've been travelling a lot, and am behind on all Debian stuff
18:10:57 <n0rman> moray: could it be accomodation?
18:11:06 <gwolf> right... wait, building query
18:11:09 <moray> though some people are trying to get me to work for their Zurich-based company, so presumably at that point I'd become super-efficient and get everything done ;)
18:11:09 <gwolf> but please go on
18:11:28 <moray> there's another point here "blocking hotels"
18:11:37 <moray> I guess that means, reserving the right numbers of rooms?
18:11:41 <PancakeRabbit> right, I put it on the wiki
18:11:48 <PancakeRabbit> we need to block hotels
18:11:53 <PancakeRabbit> at least the small ones
18:11:54 <h01ger> PancakeRabbit, who are you?
18:12:03 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, PancakeRabbit = leogg
18:12:12 <h01ger> ah. hi!
18:12:22 <PancakeRabbit> I don't have access to my computer atm, sorry
18:12:27 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, hola :)
18:12:43 <gwolf> right - And before reconfirmation, we should be able to say to people precisely how much they will pay for their stay
18:12:54 <gwolf> so we have to have at least the final rough distribution of people in hotels
18:13:07 <moray> I suggest details on this are done by email
18:13:12 * h01ger noted we paid 26 USD bank fees for some sponsorship - was that isic or spi=
18:13:13 <h01ger> ?
18:13:16 <moray> as it probably depends on the consistentcy checking first
18:13:29 <n0rman> h01ger: SPI
18:13:30 * h01ger wishes http://wiki.debconf.org would load
18:13:41 <h01ger> n0rman, ui. "wow" :/
18:14:16 <darst> h01ger, it has always been that way, we just never see it until the end
18:14:18 <moray> so, any more we can/should discuss on this topic now, or we move on?
18:14:23 <n0rman> h01ger: it's a fee from ClickandPledge as schultmc explained to me
18:14:34 <darst> (not SPI, but credit card transaction fees)
18:14:46 <h01ger> for each transaction 26 USD?
18:15:03 <PancakeRabbit> moray, yes... blocking hotels, should we do it now or wait until reconfirmation?
18:15:04 <darst> $0.35 + 4% for each credit card transaction
18:15:20 <Clint> ouch
18:15:28 <moray> PancakeRabbit: depends if you need to pay for that or not
18:15:45 <moray> PancakeRabbit: better to pay as late as possible, but obviously we need to have 'enough' rooms
18:15:48 <darst> again, this is every year, it's just we never had accounting before (until post-debconf when no one looks)
18:15:48 <PancakeRabbit> moray, no, we don't need to pay right away
18:15:53 <moray> the sponsored numbers *will* reduce compared to the current ones
18:16:00 <h01ger> blocking hotels = booking them?
18:16:01 <PancakeRabbit> yep
18:16:06 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, yes
18:16:22 <moray> if we commit to paying for too many we get problems later
18:16:22 <cate> but we can blocking 50% of the rooms (it would be easier to check fewer more rooms
18:16:59 <gwolf> if we have a decent modicum of flexibility with the hotels, that (or something like that) should be doable
18:17:13 <moray> cate: it really depends on the hotel what is best -- some will let you book N then reduce it later, some make it easy/hard to increase later
18:17:24 <PancakeRabbit> we have some flexibility with the hotels, and can reduce numbers later
18:17:31 <PancakeRabbit> (well, not too late)
18:17:53 <gwolf> (grah, participant_category_mappings are messy)
18:18:05 <moray> hotels are happier about numbers *in*creasing, but decreasing is all you can be sure works physically
18:18:28 <moray> (i.e. they may sell rooms to other people if we haven't booked them)
18:18:48 <PancakeRabbit> yes, that's why we should block them early
18:19:01 <PancakeRabbit> at least the small ones that have few rooms
18:19:19 <moray> right
18:19:31 <moray> as there are multiple hotels, it may actually be easier to reduce later than otherwise
18:19:42 <moray> as you can reduce just by cancelling a hotel or two...
18:19:47 <cate> and maybe also tha acceccible rooms (if there are very few of them)
18:19:48 <PancakeRabbit> yes, indeed
18:20:09 <PancakeRabbit> cate, we have only two accessible rooms available
18:20:16 <PancakeRabbit> at the bigger hotels
18:20:20 <PancakeRabbit> seminole and hilton
18:21:37 <moray> ok, 1/3 of meeting time gone, many topics left, so let's move this to the list
18:21:45 <moray> #topic Internet/connectivity status
18:22:27 <moray> #addchair h01ger
18:22:34 <n0rman> We had a meeting yesterday with another ISP (check sponsors-table) and they are discussing our request
18:22:39 <moray> (I can never quite remember these commands)
18:22:48 <n0rman> they will give us an answer this week, probably friday
18:23:11 <moray> so, anything to discuss today?
18:23:37 <gwolf> n0rman: have you got an answer from the Navega people?
18:24:03 <n0rman> noup, not here, we are working this area, next week we will visit UCA to re-check again if the switch (the one will have boorrowed now) works
18:24:12 <PancakeRabbit> afaik they we're going to answer this week
18:24:12 <n0rman> gwolf: not yet
18:24:33 <gwolf> they were scheduled to have an answer by the 20th, right?
18:24:36 * h01ger will have to leave at 2115...
18:24:43 <h01ger> or 1915 in UTC
18:25:10 <h01ger> please ping navega
18:25:19 <n0rman> gwolf: right, I will call him today
18:25:20 <h01ger> also if "another isp" cannot deliver
18:25:35 <h01ger> +yay for checking the switch next week
18:25:37 <h01ger> mucho yay
18:25:45 <h01ger> next topic?
18:26:15 <cate> Debian Day status
18:26:21 <h01ger> i know :)
18:26:22 <moray> #topic Debian day status
18:26:26 <PancakeRabbit> not much to say here... we already have 7 talks and pinged a lot of people
18:26:30 <moray> this isn't really urgent yet, anyway
18:26:37 <PancakeRabbit> so we probably have two parallel tracks
18:26:38 <h01ger> how many talks to do you need?
18:26:39 <PancakeRabbit> EOF
18:26:50 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, probably 3-4 more
18:26:53 <h01ger> #topic food team status
18:27:00 <moray> #topic Food team status
18:27:03 <PancakeRabbit> so, regarding food
18:27:09 <moray> (I guess I got the command wrong earlier)
18:27:12 <PancakeRabbit> we found a new place at UCA
18:27:13 <h01ger> #info debian day needs 3-4 more talks (in spanish)
18:27:20 <h01ger> yay!!
18:27:24 <PancakeRabbit> which is much better than the old one
18:27:34 <PancakeRabbit> but still, we need to rent a tent
18:27:36 <moray> does it have a roof? :)
18:27:37 <h01ger> why better?
18:27:38 <moray> ah, no
18:27:45 <h01ger> or how..
18:27:46 <PancakeRabbit> it's not optimal, but it's better
18:27:57 <n0rman> h01ger: is bigger than el paseo de las memorias
18:27:59 <gwolf> new place at UCA? YAY!!!
18:28:06 <PancakeRabbit> it's an open space
18:28:09 <n0rman> is a parking place
18:28:10 <gwolf> it has light?
18:28:12 <PancakeRabbit> a parking lot, actually
18:28:27 <h01ger> further away?
18:28:30 <PancakeRabbit> gwolf, we need to install some light bulbs
18:28:34 <mangoderosa> some, but we need to put some more
18:28:35 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, 50 meters away
18:28:37 <h01ger> & wireless :)
18:28:40 <PancakeRabbit> near teran
18:28:45 <PancakeRabbit> mangoderosa, o/
18:28:46 <n0rman> mangoderosa: you are here! :) great!
18:28:48 <gwolf> h01ger: we can live without wireless for food :)
18:28:49 <moray> h01ger: we save money on food if it's too hot for people to walk to it ;)
18:28:50 <nattie> near Tehran?  that's a bit far...
18:28:51 <h01ger> teran is the main auditorium?
18:28:59 <PancakeRabbit> teran is the hacklab
18:29:04 <h01ger> ah
18:29:07 <h01ger> cool
18:29:25 <h01ger> any other food news?
18:29:27 <nattie> so would the setup be sort of cafeteria-style then?
18:29:31 <PancakeRabbit> mangoderosa, about the food provider?
18:29:32 <n0rman> h01ger: terán is the one that is in the building where gwolf foung the accesible bathroom
18:29:36 <PancakeRabbit> n0rman, right
18:29:41 <PancakeRabbit> sorry
18:29:44 <h01ger> el hacklab
18:29:45 <PancakeRabbit> nattie, yes
18:29:50 <n0rman> h01ger: right
18:29:53 <nattie> cool
18:29:53 <gwolf> n0rman: I think it will be easier for us (me?) if we start refering to our spaces by our names ;-)
18:30:04 <h01ger> gwolf, so, hacklab
18:30:07 <h01ger> ;p
18:30:09 <gwolf> I don't know where's Terán, Gorostiza (Gorostiaga? Gorostieta?)
18:30:12 <h01ger> any other food news?
18:30:12 <gwolf> etc
18:30:24 <mangoderosa> we're almost settled with Jim. he works by himself, but has a lot of experience with events. he's charging U$5 for each meal
18:30:37 <mangoderosa> he already sent us a menu proposal
18:30:45 <moray> do we need to commit to fixed numbers of people each meal?
18:30:51 <gwolf> moray: (back to topic #1)    →    http://paste.debian.net/170642/    (and we can discuss it later on - I can produce, of course, the list of people, but won't paste it publicly)
18:30:52 <mangoderosa> which we found pretty good
18:30:53 <moray> (I assume so with the tent setup)
18:30:58 <PancakeRabbit> (menu proposal is in svn, btw)
18:31:05 <mangoderosa> moray that would help a lot!
18:31:19 <nattie> just to catch me up, is there a ticket system for meals, or how is this being done?
18:31:20 <h01ger> http://media.debconf.org/dc12/map/uca-map.png - the hacklab is marked "hacklab" and the food location is the old one
18:31:25 <moray> mangoderosa: well, it's better for us (obviously) if we only pay for what is eaten
18:31:32 <mangoderosa> we're still working on that
18:31:35 <h01ger> someone please give me coordinates for the new location
18:31:36 <moray> nattie: ticket system is the only one that really works for us
18:31:50 <gwolf> nattie: we need you to hand out the ticket-granting tickets.
18:31:53 <nattie> i'm willing to knock up a pdf of tickets if need be
18:31:55 <nattie> yes, yes
18:32:12 <nattie> if you could send the ninjas after 8th july, please
18:32:17 <mangoderosa> yes, we'll talk to the provider about that (left overs=
18:32:21 <h01ger> mangoderosa, 5USD per meal is awesome!
18:32:34 <h01ger> so we provide lunch+dinner and leave breakfast to the attendees?
18:32:36 <mangoderosa> we'll be trying out the food this week
18:32:37 <PancakeRabbit> i'm lost with h01ger's upside down map
18:32:37 <moray> yes
18:32:48 <mangoderosa> hehe!!
18:32:51 <h01ger> PancakeRabbit, right. that should be fixed as well...
18:33:01 <n0rman> h01ger: 5USD without drinks. Breakfast in included in hotels
18:33:05 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, breakfast is included at the hotels
18:33:06 <moray> h01ger: by turning all the local team members upside-down to match?
18:33:13 <PancakeRabbit> :)
18:33:19 <h01ger> #info food prices will be 5 USD/meal without drinks, for lunch and dinner. Breakfast in included in hotels
18:33:32 <h01ger> someone please do something^w^wupdate the budget :)
18:33:35 <gwolf> great, great :-D
18:33:49 <h01ger> any other food news? or next topic?
18:33:54 <n0rman> h01ger: we will update once we have jim quote
18:33:59 <gwolf> Drinks... could we just provide a big jar of flavored water and be done with it?
18:34:02 <gwolf> it should be very inexpensive
18:34:03 <mangoderosa> someone also suggested selling meals for people who didnt ask for sponsorship, so that's another thing to think about in the ticket system, right?
18:34:05 <moray> gwolf: *water*??
18:34:08 <n0rman> gwolf: yes, we can :)
18:34:23 <h01ger> nomada, according to mangoderosa 5min ago its 5usd. or?
18:34:36 <moray> gwolf: but I think alcohol may not be allowed on the campus setup?
18:34:38 <h01ger> and even ifs thats not final yet, its probably a better estimate
18:34:39 <nattie> mangoderosa: people can buy spare tickets at frontdesk, then
18:34:52 <n0rman> h01ger: that was what jim told us, but I think we need an official quote
18:34:52 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, USD5 without drinks
18:34:53 <gwolf> moray: no, alcohol is strictly not allowed
18:35:13 <moray> right, so flavoured water is what we want, really
18:35:16 <mangoderosa> we'll have the official quote this week
18:35:21 <h01ger> nice nice
18:35:49 <h01ger> next topic or still need to discuss how tickets will be handled in detail? /me thinks this can+should be discussed after meeting...
18:35:55 <h01ger> (ie via this mail thread)
18:36:02 <PancakeRabbit> i agree
18:36:03 <mangoderosa> i agree!
18:36:07 <gwolf> h01ger: I think that will be settled once in Managua
18:36:09 <moray> #topic Sponsors payments
18:36:19 <moray> what's this about?  actual incoming money?
18:36:23 <gwolf> h01ger: Tickets are usually prone to lots of place-specific details
18:36:50 * h01ger thinks n0rman brought this up
18:37:18 <n0rman> moray: yes, I would like to know if we can ping sponsors who has PO but no payment yet to DebConf
18:37:49 <moray> gwolf: yes, show your badge to front desk a day in advance to get a ticket which you show in the hacklab to get a ticket which you show at the food entrance to get a ticket which you show to the staff
18:37:51 <n0rman> it's just almost one month til debcamp and only few sponsors already make the payment
18:37:52 * register says present
18:38:15 <moray> n0rman: don't be rude obviously, but yes pinging is reasonable
18:38:24 <moray> many will take a long time just to slow corporate systems
18:38:36 <n0rman> moray: yes, withougn being rude, just a little reminder
18:39:00 <n0rman> I think that's all :)
18:39:03 <register> huh lost me nick
18:39:22 <moray> #topic Sponsorship team
18:39:38 <moray> new volunteers and sponsor ideas?
18:39:45 <moray> any news from the team?
18:39:55 <moray> secret $5 million donations?
18:40:02 * gwolf has approached several could-be sponsors... but no luck at all :(
18:40:12 <n0rman> Last meeting it was decided to create the sponsorship rating team, but it's not working yet
18:40:35 <gaudenz> I'm volunteering to draft a mail to be sent to all Debian consultants if you think thats a good idea.
18:41:06 <n0rman> is supposed i'm in charge, but don't know how this team works, so don't know if we need another persona with experience to be in charge of this group, of I there's a place whereI can learn about this group
18:41:09 <moray> gaudenz: worth trying
18:41:12 <gwolf> gaudenz: we lose nothing by doing so, and can get some money from them
18:41:13 <gwolf> so, please do!
18:41:34 <h01ger> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/TravelSponsorship has a lot of info
18:41:39 <gaudenz> and what about the companies on the partners page? Did you already contact all of them?
18:41:43 * h01ger thinks this topic is about spending money
18:41:46 <h01ger> not getting
18:41:51 <n0rman> right
18:41:54 <h01ger> (which we obviously also still need to do)
18:42:01 <gaudenz> sorry for the noise then...
18:42:17 <moray> #topic Sponsored accommodation/travel team
18:42:18 <gwolf> gaudenz: no noise at all if you get us ≥US$10K ;-)
18:42:18 <n0rman> gaudenz: we contacted then, pabs also wrote to debian derivatives I think, but with no result
18:42:19 <h01ger> n0rman, have you read http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/TravelSponsorship ?
18:42:56 <gaudenz> gwolf: ;-) (after all we need to get money to spend it...)
18:43:11 <n0rman> *them
18:43:13 <moray> gaudenz: not all localteams believe that ;)
18:43:41 <n0rman> h01ger: yes
18:43:55 <h01ger> n0rman, as a next step is suggest to form a team fast
18:44:09 <h01ger> ie by asking on the -team list +here+now who wants to help
18:44:16 <h01ger> then schedule your first meeting
18:44:25 <h01ger> and go through all registrants
18:44:31 <moray> and/or use phil's clever system ;)
18:44:32 <h01ger> ask gwolf or fitoria to join
18:44:32 <cate> n0rman: I can help you
18:44:37 <h01ger> as they have penta access
18:44:39 <moray> (but that probably takes too much time)
18:44:49 <n0rman> h01ger: thanks :)
18:44:58 <n0rman> I will write to -team list
18:45:01 * gaudenz is also willing to help with that if I'm welcome.
18:45:06 <h01ger> cate, help him by setting the via doodle
18:45:17 <h01ger> just take load away from n0rman i'm sure he will appreciate
18:45:43 <cate> ok
18:45:44 <gaudenz> doodle to schedule the meeting?
18:45:53 <h01ger> yup
18:46:10 <h01ger> who else wnats to be on the team?
18:46:24 * gwolf would rather not be, but h01ger has a compelling argument
18:46:51 <moray> h01ger: they can reply on list too
18:46:56 <h01ger> we should ask bubulle too, he knows many different contributors
18:47:09 <cate> "nobody" on the wiki
18:47:34 <moray> what is the task of this time?  just to check for "ineligible" people, or to rank everyone?
18:47:47 <h01ger> both i'd say
18:47:54 <h01ger> but first a. then b. :)
18:48:13 <moray> ok
18:48:13 <cate> ineligible and "invalid" data
18:49:15 <n0rman> cate please add yourself in the teams wiki :)
18:49:16 <moray> #topic Any other business/next meeting
18:49:43 <gwolf> moray: I sent to the mailing list the information you requested
18:49:44 <cate> not the 18 June
18:49:51 <gwolf> (and which I had put in paste.d.n)
18:50:04 <gwolf> so we can continue the sanity checks from there
18:50:33 <PancakeRabbit> next meeting: june 6?
18:50:40 <moray> if people had invalid choices, do we let them fix it for now?
18:50:55 <moray> (and if yes, until what date do we allow fixes?)
18:51:33 <gaudenz> I'd give them one week from the time we inform them to fix their choices.
18:51:46 <gwolf> Of course, if the invalid choices are of no extra burden to us, allow them forever :)
18:51:53 <gwolf> but yes, one week seems right
18:51:55 <n0rman> I emailed people with invalid choices before may 15th, some of them fixed their options.
18:52:06 <gwolf> they are probably currently *not* able to fix all possible combinations
18:52:19 <gwolf> (i.e. if they selected "please select" and want to select "sponsored")
18:52:28 <gwolf> but they can mail me+fitoria, and we change it
18:52:31 <n0rman> gwolf: if it's ok to you, I can write them (in behalf of the registration team)
18:52:40 <n0rman> or you will do it?
18:52:43 <gwolf> n0rman: I'll be most grateful if you do
18:52:44 <gwolf> :)
18:52:56 <gwolf> n0rman: do you want me to send the non-grouped list to your mail?
18:53:03 <gwolf> (with people's name and mail0
18:53:04 <gwolf> )
18:53:11 <n0rman> gwolf: please, I will appreciate that :)
18:53:35 <h01ger> shouldnt we start with weekly meetings now?
18:53:42 <h01ger> and keep them short, that is within 60min :)
18:54:17 <PancakeRabbit> we probably should
18:54:20 <gwolf> yes
18:54:21 * register why i'm exiled
18:54:23 <h01ger> also, maybe switch to tuesday?
18:54:25 <PancakeRabbit> we're six weeks away
18:54:32 <n0rman> yes
18:54:35 <h01ger> so may 29th or 30th it is
18:54:42 * h01ger is fine with both
18:55:00 <h01ger> s/both/any of the two/ :)
18:55:05 <n0rman> if it's possible 29th  :)
18:55:07 * PancakeRabbit too
18:55:22 <moray> ok
18:55:23 <gwolf> same for me
18:55:28 <gwolf> any is OK
18:55:35 <gwolf> (both is NOT)
18:55:38 <n0rman> :D
18:55:42 <h01ger> #info next meeting again tuesday, may 29th, 18 utc
18:55:43 <n0rman> so, 29?
18:55:46 <gaudenz> tuesday is better for me.
18:55:47 <n0rman> great :)
18:55:59 <moray> AOB?
18:56:00 <h01ger> tshirt status? ;)
18:56:18 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, we're still trying to get more quotes
18:56:29 <n0rman> we will fo to Masaya on friday
18:56:32 <h01ger> y design?
18:56:33 <n0rman> PancakeRabbit: will you go with me? :)
18:56:35 <PancakeRabbit> we'll make a decision next meeting, probably
18:56:44 <h01ger> n0rman, as daytrip trailer?
18:56:45 <PancakeRabbit> n0rman, yes :)
18:56:53 <h01ger> ah. to get quotes
18:57:11 <PancakeRabbit> t-shirts, atendee bags, cups
18:57:16 <gwolf> n0rman: Your PGP key id?
18:57:30 <h01ger> cups??? :)
18:57:31 <gwolf> (will check it, of course
18:57:32 <gwolf> )
18:57:41 <h01ger> y day trip?
18:57:50 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, yes, it was an idea of the food team
18:58:05 <n0rman> h01ger: nop, as get-as-much-quotes-as-we-can-for-shirts-and-bags day :)
18:58:07 <h01ger> to where?
18:58:09 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, granada is the best choice atm
18:58:34 <PancakeRabbit> h01ger, i'll try to ping day trip team to start working on that
18:59:03 <gwolf> n0rman: I have E36163A1, but no signatures on it
18:59:05 <h01ger> nice
18:59:06 <gwolf> Why is it so?
18:59:21 <h01ger> n0rman, uhm, i signed some key of yours some weeks ago
18:59:37 <gwolf> n0rman: I prefer sending you an encrypted mail if it contains all of our attendees' personal data :-/
19:00:03 <mangoderosa> h01ger, about cups it's so that we don't produce that much waste. we'd still need to buy cups to serve coffee, so we thought we get some that could last more and contamine less
19:00:13 * h01ger has signed 1EA3 278A - gwolf
19:00:35 <h01ger> mangoderosa, very nice!
19:00:44 <h01ger> so.. AOB?
19:00:57 <h01ger> (any other business/topic that is)
19:01:22 <PancakeRabbit> tomorrow we have a meeting with police dept. to talk about security in the dc area
19:01:43 * h01ger thanks everyone for attending and wishes a good $time of the day :-)
19:01:48 <gwolf> h01ger: right, I'll send to that key.
19:02:09 <moray> #endmeeting