19:59:45 <marga> #startmeeting
19:59:45 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Mar  2 19:59:45 2015 UTC.  The chair is marga. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
19:59:45 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
19:59:55 <marga> Hello everyone, thanks for coming, please say hellow
20:00:01 <RichiH> hellow
20:00:04 <DLange> o/ hellow
20:00:08 <rmayorga> hola
20:00:11 <RichiH> (loni will arrive shortly)
20:00:16 <tassia> hi
20:00:19 <larjona_mobile> I have a hackergotchi ready
20:00:25 <santiago> buenas buenas
20:00:26 <larjona_mobile> hi
20:00:32 <cate> ciao
20:00:33 * madduck 
20:00:57 <marga> #link Agenda at https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf15/Germany/Minutes/2015-03-02
20:01:09 <maxy> hi
20:01:15 <marga> #topic Non-sponsored attendees during DebCamp
20:01:35 <marga> This was discussed during the weekend, and I basically just want to verify that we agree on this
20:01:55 <marga> People that come to DebCamp but pay for their stay don't need to have a DebCamp plan. Agreed?
20:02:02 <maxy> +1
20:02:07 <larjona_mobile> +1
20:02:20 <bremner> +1
20:02:29 <madduck> but we should make sure that nobody thinks they can come have a holiday and hang out with people keeping them from their plans
20:02:42 <marga> If someone (sponsored or not) misbehaves (distracting others, partying instead of working, etc), they should be called to attention by orga, regardless of if they paid or not
20:03:01 <_rene_> sorry for being late, here
20:03:02 <madduck> right, and this should be made clear beforehand
20:03:18 <azeem> .
20:03:19 <RichiH> +1
20:03:21 <marga> how do you propose to do that?
20:03:24 <tassia> madduck, I'm not sure if it is needed
20:03:28 <bremner> fine, but I find the level of distrust in DebCamp attendees distressing
20:03:35 <madduck> tassia: neither
20:03:39 <cate> I don't think it is a problem. DebCamp usually was "free" to paying attendees, and without problem AFAIK
20:03:42 <madduck> but maybe just a sentence to the registration form?
20:03:43 <tassia> it is obvious, by the goals of the conference and DebCamp
20:04:00 <marga> I agree with Tassia, I don't think we need to add more boilerplate
20:04:04 <madduck> dc7/dc8/dc9 debcamps which I went to had problems here
20:04:10 <madduck> ok, i rest my case anyway
20:04:21 <marga> #agreed People that come to DebCamp but pay for their stay don't need to have a DebCamp plan
20:04:30 <marga> #agreed If someone (sponsored or not) misbehaves (distracting others, partying instead of working, etc), they should be called to attention by orga team
20:04:40 <larjona_mobile> In the venue, with the otger recommendations?
20:04:40 <marga> #topic Summit status update
20:05:04 <cate> I think we are almost ready. Major problem are solved
20:05:29 <cate> https://debian.titanpad.com/17? has still few bugs, but IMHO not a blockover. I'll try to correct most of them in the next days
20:05:37 <madduck> VAT changes again, but I can take care of them in registration.xhtml
20:05:39 <cate> [and it should no be a problem changing minor things live]
20:05:44 <maxy> larjona_mobile: We usually don't have a front desk working till DebConf.
20:06:20 <marga> I agree that we can do some minor changes live
20:06:30 <madduck> #action madduck to inform cate by tomorrow night of the final attendance fee choices
20:06:47 <madduck> cate: are we limited to select option boxes? no radio buttons?
20:06:50 <marga> cate, maxy and I both registered, and I expect other people did as well.  Is that info in the DB, everything looking good?
20:07:29 <cate> madduck: we can have anything html has.  I just don't know how ;-)
20:07:45 <madduck> cate: ok. that is just candy really
20:07:47 <madduck> also, are we set on "dietary restrictions"? and was there a clear decision to not allow free-form comments on food preferences?
20:07:49 <cate> The photo option was a selection box IIRC
20:08:21 <cate> madduck: we [pa] prefer to contact people with email. Possibly with an automatic first mail
20:08:45 <cate> and then discuss with you [local team] about what is possible.
20:09:00 <madduck> ok. speaking of photo, the upload doesn't seem to work…
20:09:03 <marga> cate, but how will you know that you have to contact them?
20:09:09 <RichiH> cate: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5924988/radio-buttons-in-django-forms
20:09:10 <marga> Or are you saying you'll contact everybody?
20:09:36 <cate> marga: we check the differences on databases. We will do the same for childcare and disabilities
20:09:50 <marga> cate, which differences?
20:10:05 <marga> cate, I believe madduck is asking for an extra text field to add allergies
20:10:23 <marga> I think this can be solved by suggesting adding allergies to the general comment box
20:10:25 <madduck> marga: he knows. but he says registration prefers to do email
20:10:44 <madduck> fine by me. we'll work it out and learn for the future ;)
20:10:50 <marga> Yes, but I don't understand how email will work, if there's no input from the attendee.
20:11:03 <madduck> oh, there is "other contact orga"
20:11:03 <cate> madduck: comments are difficult to parte automatically, and we risk to forget some cases, until we review all attendee data
20:12:07 <madduck> … which we need to do anyway, no?
20:12:18 <madduck> anyway, I am fine leaving this up to cate to decide and just drive on
20:12:27 <madduck> we should set a date when to "open registration"
20:12:41 <marga> Yes, and who sends what where
20:12:42 <cate> yeah. I would do like previous years
20:12:53 <marga> I think we should open tomorrow
20:12:56 <cate> marga: we [registration]
20:13:09 <cate> so...
20:13:10 <marga> cate, you what?
20:13:15 <madduck> cate: do think about what could be improved and then maybe we can make the process easier in the future.
20:13:46 <cate> marga: we send mail about childare / dietary preferences / diasbilities to relevant people
20:14:08 <cate> to all: please register and test summit;debconf.org
20:14:20 <marga> Alright. We are moving on to setting the date and deciding who sends what where
20:14:50 <cate> madduck: yes, I hope next time [also later this year] also some more tracking tools
20:15:09 <marga> #action everyone: Please register at https://summit.debconf.org/debconf15/registration/ and report issues on https://debian.titanpad.com/17
20:15:28 <marga> Are there any blockers to opening registration tomorrow?
20:15:59 <marga> Who wants to send the email?
20:16:10 <RichiH> should we time the press release to that?
20:16:15 <marga> Should it be debconf-announce and debian-devel-announce?
20:16:20 <RichiH> i think both
20:16:28 <marga> Anything else?
20:16:32 <RichiH> the people on either may be different
20:16:36 <azeem> my suggestion was to combine the press release with the call for proposals
20:16:47 <RichiH> also fine by me
20:16:56 <cate> https://debian.titanpad.com/19  has a draft version
20:17:00 <azeem> marga: I think those two are cool, but probably also a blogpost and possibly bits
20:17:09 <maxy> marga: A debconf news post ?
20:17:14 <azeem> or we also combine that with cfp
20:17:46 <cate> two mails is better, but press release could be unified.
20:17:58 <maxy> azeem: The idea is to use the cfp as a reminder to register
20:18:17 <maxy> azeem: At least thats what ana proposed.
20:18:26 <RichiH> maxy: that's not a bad idea
20:18:52 <rmayorga> so, registration goes to the mailing lists, and cfp on a press release(bits.d.o, blog, mail)
20:18:58 <DLange> I think a cfp will be reported in any tech news site we send it to
20:19:04 <rmayorga> and works as a reminder for the registration as well
20:19:05 <DLange> so that's a good level for coverage
20:19:13 <DLange> lever, too
20:20:54 <marga> #agreed Registration announcement to be sent to: debconf-announce, debian-devel-announce, debconf blog post
20:21:04 <maxy> marga is having technical lags..
20:21:04 <marga> #agreed CFP to be sent later, to mailing lists, blog posts, + press release
20:21:36 <maxy> Who would send the registration announcement?
20:22:06 <RichiH> if no one else steps up, i can
20:22:11 <cate> if press team will not do it, I can do it
20:22:14 <highvoltage> something is wrong at "Are you applying for sponsorship ot debcamp?"
20:22:19 <RichiH> cate you are welcome to
20:22:28 * RichiH just does not want to dwell on that part for ages
20:22:30 <marga> highvoltage, yeah, already reported
20:22:36 <highvoltage> righto
20:22:37 * larjona_mobile cannot talk in behalf of press team...
20:22:44 <cate> highvoltage: and corrected [just not yet committed]
20:22:49 * madduck notes that the "press release" really should have some content to advertise, e.g. some keynotes, some speakers and some programme
20:23:06 <madduck> honestly, the "press" does not care about our registration or cfp
20:23:11 <madduck> they might care about our conf
20:23:16 <madduck> if the content is interesting
20:23:19 <azeem> let's decide on who sends out the registration mail first?
20:23:26 <marga> Personally, I think the registration announcement should be sent by someone from the DC15 group.
20:23:34 <cate> madduck: lwn and such sites write also about announced conferenced and cfp
20:23:38 <marga> I know we are all DC15 now
20:23:58 <madduck> i can send the registration announcement.
20:24:11 <marga> Anyway, I don't know what I'm trying to say
20:24:14 <DLange> madduck: they care about cfp. Heise always reports these to offset their own conferences' cfps that spam the newsticker...
20:24:26 <tassia> why not the attendes assitance team?
20:24:32 <tassia> cate?
20:24:35 <madduck> ok, but they might just need a quick link, not a press release.
20:24:56 <cate> tassia: me, RichiH, madduck. Now we have too many people ;-)
20:24:57 <tassia> who is gonna deal with registration is the most appropriate person/team IMHO
20:24:58 <madduck> yes, cate should send. press team won't care.
20:25:00 <marga> Yeah....
20:25:02 <azeem> cate already volunteered, so why not
20:25:06 <marga> Ok
20:25:07 <tassia> so cate
20:25:08 * azeem nominates cate
20:25:11 * Tincho is here (late)
20:25:13 <madduck> poor cate
20:25:17 <marga> #action cate to send registration announcement
20:25:19 <marga> Tomorrow?
20:25:25 <madduck> force-volunteered
20:25:25 <RichiH> sounds good
20:25:29 <madduck> yes, ASAP
20:25:38 <tassia> madduck, he has volunteered, nothing was forced
20:25:40 <marga> #agreed Tomorrow (March 3rd) if possible.
20:25:53 <maxy> the date was forced.
20:25:55 <marga> #topic CFP Status
20:26:07 <marga> We mostly covered this, but just in case there's something not convered...
20:26:14 <marga> Is there anything that needs to happen for the CFP?
20:26:22 <marga> I know we are waiting a little bit, is there a set date?
20:26:30 <madduck> the content team wants to sent 10 march; I do wonder why we have to wait this long.
20:26:34 <marga> Who will send it?
20:26:44 <rmayorga> I think we are set on that part, we've share what we have on the mailing list
20:26:44 * madduck shuts up
20:26:53 <cate> CfP needs tracks
20:26:53 <maxy> cate: if you dont have the time pass it on to any of the other "volunteers". :)
20:27:02 <azeem> there some track proposals
20:27:07 <azeem> +are
20:27:11 <rmayorga> regarding who will send it, we will decide on it, no need to agree on that now thought
20:27:17 <marga> ok
20:27:29 <marga> I just want to make sure there are no blockers
20:27:34 <cate> but none in summit. [and choose the default one, which should be put now as first track]
20:27:39 <azeem> one thing I wondered is whether we should encourage specific people to submit, like e.g. women
20:27:45 <azeem> cate: ah, ok
20:27:52 <azeem> that's a good point
20:27:54 <rmayorga> cate: agree, that part is still missing, summit-admin part
20:27:55 <santiago> I think the main blocker was to open registration
20:28:24 <RichiH> azeem: as in, make a list or a general statement?
20:28:25 <rmayorga> azeem: I can create tracks, not sure if you already have admin perms. on summit, but I think you should :)
20:28:35 <RichiH> the former will lead to... crap
20:28:37 <marga> azeem, do you have a proposal regarding how to do that?
20:28:40 <azeem> I used to have some from last year
20:28:42 <madduck> azeem: I think you might want to say that we encourage submissions from everyone and we will select only based on content, not on anything else. But I wouldn't walk the thin line of trying to name a few minorities… but not others.
20:28:51 <azeem> marga: what is "that"?
20:29:12 <marga> encourage specific people to submit
20:29:15 <azeem> ah
20:29:23 <azeem> not really, it just crossed my mind earlier
20:29:33 <RichiH> the problem is that you will miss _someone_
20:29:51 <azeem> so not a baked proposal, so better to carry on I guess
20:29:55 <tassia> we leave if open
20:29:57 <tassia> like
20:30:09 <marga> Regarding women, I think it's easy to 1) send the CFP to debian-women with an encouraging message 2) encourage DW minidebconf speakers to also submit to debconf
20:30:23 <madduck> marga: good ideas
20:30:26 <tassia> "we encourage submission from minority groups. If you identify yourself as such, please state it in your submission"
20:30:29 <RichiH> marga++
20:30:41 <azeem> is minidebconf before the closing of the CfP?
20:30:46 <azeem> seems so, yeah
20:30:50 <marga> Yes, May 16/17
20:31:13 <marga> Anyway, we should move on.
20:31:36 <azeem> ack, your plans sounds perfect
20:31:38 <madduck> tassia: I'd hate to pick a submission from a minority group just because it comes from a minority group, but that's another topic.
20:31:38 <maxy> madduck asked about the lightning talks, should we include that in the cfp?
20:31:53 <azeem> well, we're not asking for them
20:31:56 <azeem> right now
20:32:00 <madduck> true that
20:32:08 <maxy> cate: (or in summit?)
20:32:11 <azeem> we could either include it in the PR, or just mention them
20:32:14 <madduck> maxy: I think we should let people we reject know about them.
20:32:29 <DLange> yeah, I'd not over complicate things
20:32:38 <tassia> madduck, we are not saying so, just that we encourage submissions
20:32:45 <azeem> OTOH, we shouldn't open them too early, cause usually they are/should be spontaneous as well
20:32:50 <Tincho> azeem: I 've seen accounts of that kind of efforts, we might want to explore it, but it is not tied to the cfp
20:33:02 <marga> Ok, just something to keep in mind, let's move on.
20:33:04 <DLange> azeem: and not shy people away from a "proper" submission
20:33:09 <marga> #topic DC15 Budget
20:33:15 <marga> madduck, ?
20:33:23 <madduck> http://scratch.madduck.net/2015-03-02-dc15_budget_proposal.pdf
20:33:28 <madduck> or the budget.ods file
20:33:38 <azeem> elevator pitch, please
20:33:42 <madduck> basically I'd be ready to hand this to chairs and DPL and get a signoff ASAP
20:33:51 <madduck> but I made assumptions in there
20:33:56 <madduck> so my suggestion/request is
20:34:14 <madduck> let me know anything you wonder about or might want to see changed by the end of the week
20:34:30 <madduck> which is when I will send the final proposal
20:34:48 <azeem> what about invited speakers?
20:34:52 <marga> madduck, I'd like to see it more clear what is already a reality and what is an expectation regarding sponsors.
20:34:53 <madduck> i tried to do a good, balanced job, but I am not trying to claim I am the one to decide how our money gets spent.
20:35:17 <madduck> azeem: there is a budget of 10k in there for invited speakers, newbies and diversity outreach together.
20:35:32 <bremner> madduck: I've been campaigning for a split between travel costs for volunteers and those for "normal" attendees
20:35:32 <madduck> marga: then you open the .ods file and change the income scenario to status quo
20:35:35 <azeem> ok
20:35:38 <maxy> madduck: The fundraise numbers in the pdf are projections or current amounts?
20:35:41 <rmayorga> madduck: ok, I assume it was on outreach program
20:35:48 <madduck> maxy: projections; it's a budget.
20:36:01 <cate> Childcare: usually we support the idea and organization stuffs, but not costs
20:36:03 <DLange> but 70% of the sponsor budget is already secured
20:36:04 <madduck> rmayorga: it is "outreach", that is how I categorised it.
20:36:28 <madduck> cate: yes, and we are investigating changing that.
20:36:59 <Tincho> one thing on budget, that I forgot to follow in the past couple of weeks: the idea about having LWN come to debconf to report on it, and sponsoring their trip
20:37:15 <madduck> Tincho: outreach programme budget for now
20:37:25 <madduck> we might later create a PR budget line too
20:38:03 <madduck> so, let's not discuss details here, but let me know by the end of the week and we can chat
20:38:10 <azeem> I'm worried because we might have to allocate LWN and invited speakers early, diversity and newbies will suffer
20:38:14 <azeem> but ok
20:38:14 <madduck> i will submit to chairs for approval end of this week
20:38:20 <maxy> marga is lagged again, remain calm and keep discussing.
20:38:24 <bremner> madduck: shouldn't we discuss the budget on list onr in a meeting?
20:38:33 <madduck> bremner: should we?
20:38:38 <marga> #action(everyone): review budget and send any comments to madduck before the end of the week
20:38:40 <marga> #topic Press Releases
20:38:40 <marga> We covered most of this already
20:38:42 <marga> We want only one press release, including registration and CFP, right?
20:38:44 <marga> And larjona_mobile will handle that?
20:38:48 <marga> Who wants to take the updating the planet.d.o hackergotchi action?
20:38:51 <cate> No network expendable stuffs? <<- RichiH
20:39:03 <bremner> madduck: otherwise we are giving you final say on the budget
20:39:15 <madduck> no, the chairs
20:39:16 <bremner> which is OK, if that's what people want
20:39:17 <larjona> hackergotchi is ready
20:39:19 <RichiH> http://paste.debian.net/hidden/cdba92e8/ < draft of a german press release
20:39:22 <RichiH> for "normal" media
20:39:28 * larjona is searching for the proposal
20:39:29 <RichiH> cate: ?
20:39:56 <tassia> madduck, I agree we should discuss it more openly
20:40:00 <DLange> switches, cables, pay for uplink?
20:40:19 <tassia> not only having the approval or not from the chairs
20:40:35 <tassia> a meeting for that seems reasonable to me
20:40:40 * fil realises the time ... sorry I'm late
20:40:48 <RichiH> DLange: uplink is free, but we should probably budget a bit for rental of APs, etc
20:40:54 <bremner> I mean, we spent more time discussing who should send the registration announcement than the budget
20:40:56 <madduck> we should distinguish between press release and press release. Assumine we have one shot at the big media (which we do), we should have a pretty juicy PR for them, which means that we should know content. We can do other press releases ("blog posts") beforehand and let people know about them.
20:41:15 <tassia> bremner, +1
20:41:22 <marga> Sorry, I'm really lagged, I thought the budget discussion had ended
20:41:23 <azeem> should we go back to budget?
20:41:24 <marga> #topic Budget - contd
20:41:54 <marga> Please discuss further
20:41:54 <DLange> RichiH: ack, so send a proposal to madduck pls. Happy to help with estimates if you need help / sanity checking.
20:41:56 <madduck> tassia: I have tried twice to organise meetings about the budget. I failed twice. I am happy for someone else to do this, and I'll be there.
20:41:57 <marga> As needed
20:42:19 <RichiH> 21:41:39 < RichiH> madduck: can we just put in a few k for random infra stuff?
20:42:41 <marga> I agree we should have a budget meeting
20:42:54 <RichiH> with my infra hat on: does a printer for front desk etc come from the infra or front desk budget?
20:42:55 <marga> madduck, how about Thursday, same time?
20:43:10 <tassia> madduck, can you send me the thread in the ML?
20:43:10 <rmayorga> madduck: you might want to change the "interesting" speakers part, for "invited" or something else
20:43:11 <cate> madduck: t-shirt are in "attendee Swag" ?
20:43:14 <RichiH> this thursday, i will be in a DC we are taking over
20:43:16 <tassia> madduck, I'm sorry if I missed it
20:43:18 <RichiH> i.e. no time
20:43:27 <rmayorga> I remember you mentioned on the mailing list, probably just forgot about it ;)
20:43:46 <madduck> man, i love IRC
20:43:55 <madduck> woman, i love IRC too
20:44:09 <tassia> ?
20:44:10 <highvoltage> what about people who are neither man or woman?
20:44:45 <tassia> madduck, can you please elaborate
20:44:48 <tassia> ?
20:44:54 <DLange> t-shirts only go to 2xl in summit, that may be a little tight for some :)
20:44:56 <madduck> ignore me.
20:45:04 <madduck> answering your messages in turn.
20:45:08 <KGB-1> 03Laura Arjona Reina 05master 3c30f1e 06debconf-data/blog 03drafts/sq_logo.png Hackergotchi for DebConf15
20:45:13 <Guest365> #chair madduck maxy
20:45:22 <madduck> RichiH: infra budget is traditionally "video team"; printer for registration is registration budget
20:45:41 <marga> heh, that was my lagged self trying to give out the chair, because it wasn't managable, but I took over from outside dircproxy now
20:45:54 <marga> We are going to run out of time if we want to discuss the whole budget here.
20:46:04 <madduck> marga_: yes, I can forego another debconf-free evening this week and make a budget meeting thursday, but I'd prefer 1930 UTC
20:46:06 <tassia> can the coord team organize such a meeting?
20:46:06 <marga> Can we establish a date and time?
20:46:17 <azeem> did somebody volunteer to review the budget and/or has that happened yet?
20:46:17 <tassia> maybe call a dudle?
20:46:18 <madduck> tassia: i will dig out the thread later
20:46:19 <Tincho> madduck: dunno if you did it already, but it would be good to ask every team for their specific needs re budget
20:46:21 <azeem> cate and hug did it in the past I think
20:46:30 <madduck> Tincho: I hope i did this.
20:46:48 <madduck> cate: yes, t-shirts are in swag category
20:46:56 <madduck> rmayorga: good hint; consider it done.
20:47:07 <marga> Let's call the meeting for Thu 19:30
20:47:09 <Tincho> and there were talks about including the costs for volunteers separately from normal bursaries, bremner?
20:47:18 <bremner> yes, mentioned above
20:47:18 <marga> People that can't attend then, should send comments by mail.
20:47:19 <tassia> marga, I'd suggest opening a dudle
20:47:23 <cate> azeem: cate??
20:47:39 <KGB-0> 03Santiago Ruano Rincón 05master 3e50686 06debconf-data/dc15 10schedule/debconf15-schedule.ods Daily announcementsa explicitlyOC overlapping the 5 last minutes of breakfast
20:47:40 <marga> tassia, Thursday is the day that most coord people can.
20:48:07 <madduck> tassia: dudle just means another week of delay and the problem that someone has to make a choice knowing some others can't attend. setting dates and letting people deal with it ftw
20:48:18 <Tincho> marga: it is a bit too close to this meeting, no?
20:48:21 <marga> #agreed Budget meeting to be held next Thursday, 19:30 UTC.  People that can't attend should send mail to madduck
20:48:23 <tassia> but than we should have a quorum per team
20:48:30 <maxy> santiago: why are you changing the schedule?
20:48:34 <tassia> marga, we didn't agree
20:48:35 <Tincho> and yeah, budget is pretty critical
20:48:40 <marga> Tincho, madduck wants to send this to the chairs by the end of the week.
20:48:47 <DLange> *needs*
20:48:50 <madduck> at least that was agreed about 4 months ago.
20:49:05 <tassia> madduck, what was agreed?
20:49:10 <Tincho> is there a rationale for this deadline?
20:49:11 <madduck> that i prepare the budget in feb
20:49:19 * madduck takes a chill pill
20:49:29 <tassia> yes, but the coord team needs to discuss it
20:49:36 <tassia> not only the chairs approving or not
20:49:36 <azeem> it's almost still february
20:49:43 * Tincho lagged too
20:50:05 <tassia> I didn't receive any call from the coord team to deal with budget
20:50:20 <tassia> people might just not be following
20:50:22 <Tincho> yeah, teams need to study it and be sure to attend the meeting
20:50:22 * larjona has to go, sorry: please agree on what she has to do (what to write (topic), if it's for bits, blog, or publicity team, and when is deadline) and she will do it. Planet hackergotchi ( http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/debconf-data/blog.git/plain/drafts/sq_logo.png )will be committed ASAP (already got permissions to commit into planet repo). She will care about proposing/publishing dents from identi.ca @debian official a
20:50:27 <maxy> tassia: that's not in the scope of coord
20:50:30 <madduck> larjona: thanks!
20:50:35 <marga> tassia, I'll send the email regarding sending feedback and the meeting after this meeting ends
20:50:51 <madduck> Tincho: the budget has been public for about 4 months now.
20:50:59 <madduck> receiving updates almost in real-time.
20:51:01 <tassia> maxy, yes it is
20:51:11 <maxy> tassia: ok, my bad
20:51:18 <santiago> maxy, because I've just realized another unclear point (but I don't intent to discuss today if we don't have the time)
20:51:59 <maxy> santiago: can we talk about the schedule after the meeting?
20:52:05 <Tincho> madduck: I know I did not study it in detail before, and I would really like to the teams to think about it. if they can do it, and attend the meeting on thursday, fine by me
20:52:08 <marga> madduck, can we postpone the budget meeting one week and have it on Thu March 12th, giving people more time to organized to be there?
20:52:25 <madduck> marga: yes.
20:52:30 <marga> Alright
20:52:48 <marga> #agreed Budget meeting to be held Thursday, March 12th, 19:30 UTC
20:53:02 <tassia> marga, even so, we should have  a quorum
20:53:06 <marga> Yes
20:53:11 <marga> Hopefully we can move on now.
20:53:13 <tassia> the safest thing would be to call a dudle IMHO
20:53:23 <marga> #topic Time slots and job fair scheduling
20:53:33 <azeem> what about press release?
20:53:36 <marga> We have very little time left, please let's try to get to the point.
20:53:38 <azeem> that got cut short
20:53:44 <azeem> ok
20:53:46 <marga> azeem, it was already discussed in the previous points.
20:53:52 <azeem> fair enough, go ahead
20:54:01 <marga> santiago, what did you want to discuss about this?
20:54:16 <santiago> the main point: we need to decide on the date and time for the job fair. I'd like to schedule it during the week-end, simultaneous to hack-time.
20:54:17 <madduck> he wants the job fair fixed
20:54:23 <madduck> and he wants input.
20:54:36 <santiago> But, as madduck says, it has been advertised to happen during the open week-end. And we are lacking someone who coordinates this with sponsors
20:54:54 <marga> Yes, it was advertised to be on the weekend. I think Saturday afternoon is what makes the most sense.
20:54:57 <madduck> santiago: i think sat 14–18 is the only way forward for now, and to gather feedback and maybe have it during the week at a future debconf.
20:55:00 <azeem> ack marga
20:55:09 <maxy> I think the job fair could be a whole day, and thus avoiding the schedule gap
20:55:25 <azeem> I'm worried about making it too long
20:55:31 <marga> I disagree with Maxy on this, having it be a whole day is a risk as we don't know how visited it will be
20:55:32 <maxy> (or a exclusive slot)
20:55:33 <azeem> even four hours seems stretching it
20:55:35 <RichiH> azeem: what's the specific worry?
20:55:45 <RichiH> it would allow the job fair to be spread out a bit
20:55:49 <madduck> bored personell
20:55:50 <azeem> RichiH: sponsors waiting for 2+ hours for somebody to show up?
20:55:55 <RichiH> thus, not compete with other stuff
20:55:55 <marga> Yeah
20:56:05 <marga> It will compete anyway
20:56:17 <azeem> well, I think it's fine if it competes, the only question is room allocation then
20:56:24 <Tincho> I've been to job fairs that were less than 4h long, and were more than enough
20:56:24 <madduck> make it short and crisp so that it's high density and we can do it again next year
20:56:37 <Tincho> but it was a specific event, not shared with a conf
20:56:38 <marga> Yeah, I agree with madduck
20:56:40 <azeem> yeah Tincho, maybe 3h is ok, but 4 seems fine
20:57:08 <madduck> 3 is fine too 14:30–17:30 or whatever
20:57:14 <maxy> ok, so an afternoon?
20:57:17 <Tincho> if there are enough interesting companies, you get exhausted after a couple of hours chatting with recruiters
20:57:23 <Tincho> so, 4h seems fine to me
20:57:35 <azeem> maxy: yeah
20:57:35 <santiago> +1 the afternoon
20:57:40 <maxy> What about the exclusivity>
20:57:42 <marga> #agreed Job Fair to be held on Saturday, 14:00 to 18:00
20:57:54 <azeem> I don't think we need it
20:58:01 <madduck> nope
20:58:07 <azeem> I assume the company people will not be super interested in the talks
20:58:11 <marga> It'd be nice to have a half hour break between the talks, anyway
20:58:21 <maxy> Ok, then saturday of sunday?
20:58:21 <madduck> well, we should not schedule the Richard Stallman vs. Linus Torvalds debate right then, but…
20:58:22 <azeem> so if there's say two slots, people can still go
20:58:38 <RichiH> madduck: we should also have theo
20:58:38 <madduck> maxy: sunday I don't think works; people go home, debian birthday
20:58:44 <azeem> right and desperate people can pop in during the break
20:58:59 <azeem> 21:53 < marga> Yes, it was advertised to be on the weekend. I think Saturday afternoon is what makes the most sense.
20:59:09 <marga> Yeah, there are breaks between talks anyway
20:59:28 <marga> Ok, I think this is done.
20:59:33 <azeem> we could tell sponsors to leave their HR contact
20:59:37 <Tincho> so are we talking about the closing weekend now?
20:59:41 <azeem> no
20:59:46 <marga> Tincho, nope, opening
20:59:50 <Tincho> ah, madduck's comment made me think that
21:00:05 <marga> #topic Next Meeting
21:00:07 <azeem> well, non-Debconf hardcore people might go home again
21:00:18 <tassia> marga, I had added a topic
21:00:27 <marga> tassia, I know, but we ran out of time
21:00:35 <tassia> well, it is just for information
21:00:44 <tassia> no discussion needed
21:00:45 <marga> Also, I'll cover that in a sec
21:00:58 <madduck> tassia: maybe you can let some of us know after the meeting.
21:01:02 <azeem> maybe something for a coord meeting?
21:01:11 <marga> So, I think we are suffering from meeting overload.  This is supposed the DC15 meeting, and we wanted to have a "coord team" meeting, but this is currently serving both purposes and it's kind of a mess
21:01:42 <RichiH> it did feel a tad unfocused, yes
21:01:52 <marga> We already had a "local team" meeting last week, to follow up on local issues, like conf dinner, daytrip, etc. So those issues don't need to be covered in the general team meeting
21:02:07 <marga> I think this makes sense, as otherwise there's a lot of people that's not really interested
21:02:31 <marga> Also, we need to have these coord team meetings to do more "global - across the years" stuff
21:02:47 <marga> So... I want to propose to move THIS meeting to be monthly
21:02:53 <tassia> I agree it makes sense, but ignoring a topic that was in a wiki does not seem right
21:03:06 <Tincho> I agree, but I think the wider team needs minutes or something from that meeting
21:03:06 <marga> And have the coord team meeting on Thursdays, also monthly
21:03:10 <tassia> but we definitely need coord team meetings
21:03:45 <marga> tassia, your topic is a topic for the coord team meeting that we are not having, that's what I wanted to say
21:03:59 <tassia> marga, I agreed
21:04:21 <Tincho> so, when do we have a coord meeting?
21:04:24 <tassia> marga, I just don't thing it was appropriate the way you did it
21:04:27 <azeem> so make next week's budget meeting a coord team meeting, or do you think the budget discussion takes the whole hour?
21:04:30 <marga> Tincho, minutes from what meeting?
21:04:34 <azeem> also a coord*
21:04:41 <Tincho> marga: the local team meeting
21:05:05 <marga> Ah, well, we had MeetBot, I can send the link if it wasn't sent, sure.
21:05:05 <madduck> tassia: then we should have not exploded the meeting and let marge keep her schedule planned to the minute. Which has worked well the last dozen times…
21:05:10 <maxy> So, 1 global dc15 meeting/4 weeks, 1 local team meeting/2 weeks, and 1 coord meeting every 4 weeks.
21:05:14 <cate> marga: in one months we will need to have a longer meeting
21:05:22 <Tincho> madduck: what do you mean?
21:05:26 <marga> Please, no
21:05:34 <Tincho> marga: it is pretty important to send a mail, I think
21:05:49 <marga> tassia, I didn't ignore your item, I was just consolidating it into one topic.
21:06:22 <marga> Tincho, nothing happened, we just tried to gather volunteers.  Really, nothing to write home about.
21:06:31 <tassia> madduck, let's calm down, we are all trying to discuss what we think it is important
21:06:43 <tassia> madduck, acting like this you are putting people away
21:06:44 <marga> Tincho, rest assured that if anything had happened we would have written about it.
21:07:06 <Tincho> marga: sure, I can imagine. It's more about trying to foster communication
21:07:20 <azeem> so cate says the dc15 team meeting would need to be longer, anybody else have objections to maxy's proposal?
21:07:39 <maxy> s/maxy/marga/
21:07:39 <azeem> I think if we keep the local stuff in the local meeting, we could still shoot for 60 minutes in a month
21:07:50 <marga> (it was actually my proposal, maxy was just rephrasing)
21:07:51 <cate> azeem: I was meaning: better not to delay too much the meetings, we will have more and more topics in future
21:08:18 <madduck> tassia: sorry, I am calm. I just don't think this is marga's fault.
21:08:56 <maxy> I think we could merge the dc15 global meeting with one of the local team meetings
21:09:07 <Tincho> madduck: I agree it is not her fault on the meeting being too long, but I think tassia is right in objecting the way the topic was skipped
21:09:08 <madduck> not sure about that
21:09:15 <marga> cate, the thing is, we need to have the "coord" meeting, but personally I can't really handle having yet another meeting, and I believe other people are burned out about it as well
21:09:26 <madduck> maxy: we split again after we discovered that all this global stuff and the hick-hack is putting local people off.
21:09:40 <marga> So, I want to free up time for the coord meeting by having the DC15-specific-topics meeting split from the general coord meetings
21:09:49 <Tincho> let's try to move the budget discussion to email, as much as possible
21:09:50 <azeem> I think marga's proposal makes sense
21:10:09 <azeem> now that registration is done and cfp almost, I think we could manage 4 weeks till next meeting
21:10:31 <azeem> and budget is happening elsewhere
21:10:33 <maxy> Ok, then +1 to marga's proposal.
21:10:38 <cate> let's try, but if there are too many topics, let's to meet more frequent. I really prefer short meetings, and also today we stoped earlier
21:11:01 <marga> Alright, let's agree on trying this
21:11:02 <azeem> right, we should figure it out by the end of the next meeting, whether we need another one in 2 or 4 weeks
21:11:14 <tassia> I'm ok with the proposal, but coord meeting issue should be decided within the team, doesn't need to have that regularity
21:11:44 <tassia> local biweekly and dc15 montly seems ok
21:11:51 <azeem> 22:02 < azeem> so make next week's budget meeting a coord team meeting, or do you think the budget discussion takes the whole hour?
21:11:51 <marga> #agreed We'll try to split the meetings as follows: 1 monthly DC15-specific meeting, 1 monthly coord-meeting, 2 monthly DC15-local meetings
21:12:27 <azeem> thanks marga
21:12:28 <marga> tassia, do you still want to discuss the teams now? Or shall we leave it for the coord meeting?
21:12:41 <tassia> marga, there is nothing to discuss
21:13:01 <marga> #agreed Next DC15 meeting: Monday, March 30th
21:13:04 <tassia> I'd like just to mention that
21:13:40 <tassia> I'll be reviewing team's info in the wiki and talking directly to teams in the fllowing days
21:14:14 <marga> ok
21:14:23 <marga> I guess we are done then
21:14:25 <marga> #endmeeting