20:10:02 <pollo> #startmeeting
20:10:02 <MeetBot> Meeting started Fri May 13 20:10:02 2016 UTC.  The chair is pollo. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:10:02 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
20:10:14 <pollo> sorry to break your conversation :D
20:10:32 <pollo> proposed agenda is here: https://pad.riseup.net/p/videoteam-dc16
20:10:53 <pollo> anything to add?%
20:11:09 <olasd> tumbleweed:   URL de rapatriement : https://github.com/mithro/HDMI2USB-mode-switch.git
20:11:12 <olasd> sorry
20:11:19 <tumbleweed> olasd: aha
20:11:22 <highvoltage> hey pollo
20:11:28 <pollo> highvoltage: hey
20:11:29 <olasd> (bad mithro!)
20:12:04 <olasd> pollo: sorry, nothing to add on my side :)
20:12:09 <highvoltage> pollo: which details do you need on the desktops? I can write down their full specs on monday if you need them
20:12:34 <pollo> highvoltage: that'd be great! just put it on the wiki or send me an email
20:12:43 <pollo> allright then
20:12:45 <highvoltage> pollo: ok will do
20:12:49 <pollo> #topic Follow up on last meeting's actions
20:13:11 <pollo> as you just witnessed, I did bug highvoltage for a few -things
20:13:40 <pollo> olasd started working on shipping bureaucracy on his own
20:13:58 <olasd> (yay)
20:14:00 <pollo> paddatrapper was very kind so ask for quotes
20:14:15 <pollo> I also compared prices for Fedex and UPS
20:14:18 <pollo> UPS is cheaper
20:14:23 * olasd nods
20:14:23 <paddatrapper> I have received two quotes for equipment hires and have sent them on. The latest one from Solid has a few things missing, but will be updated by the beginning of next week
20:14:26 <highvoltage> pollo: if there are still more things outstanding that I owe you, let me know. I kind of lost track the last week but it's better again now.
20:14:31 <pollo> I asked DHL for a quote, they did not answer
20:14:59 <pollo> paddatrapper: it's on the git rep?
20:15:11 <pollo> I should really mount this thing somewhere on my computer
20:15:20 <pollo> that's about it for my actions
20:15:37 <tumbleweed> sorry, I didn't follow up with UCT venue PA systems
20:15:56 <pollo> tumbleweed: do you think you can do it next week?
20:16:08 <paddatrapper> pollo: Should be
20:16:09 <tumbleweed> yeah, let me get this in a calendar...
20:16:20 <pollo> #action tumbleweed to look into the PAs at UCT
20:16:39 <pollo> and wouter's action is a long term one
20:16:52 <pollo> anything to add on this topic?
20:17:09 <paddatrapper> pollo: Stefano (sorry can't remember his nick) said he was putting it in there
20:17:52 <pollo> paddatrapper: yeah I do remember this. I'm just lazy and have git for other things that code
20:18:03 <olasd> paddatrapper: stefano is tumbleweed
20:18:06 <pollo> /s/have/hate/
20:18:21 <paddatrapper> I know the feeling
20:18:36 <tumbleweed> :)
20:18:39 <pollo> #topic Capture cards
20:18:49 <pollo> CarlFK has proposed we buy these: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/964122-REG/blackmagic_design_decklink_mini_recorder.html
20:18:55 <pollo> He tested them and they work fine. It's also what CCC uses
20:19:14 <pollo> I do not think it is worth renting them
20:19:17 <tumbleweed> HDMI input - could even work with that camera :)
20:19:30 <pollo> tumbleweed: what camera?
20:19:39 <tumbleweed> the one paddatrapper got quoted
20:19:44 <pollo> oh nice
20:19:49 <olasd> yeah, those cards will probably be usable long-term
20:19:58 <pollo> #action pollo to review the quotes from paddatrapper
20:20:10 <tumbleweed> Sony HVR-Z5 HDV
20:20:28 <pollo> can someone volunteer to buy them?
20:20:43 <paddatrapper> Though I will know by early next week if they have ones with SDI out
20:20:48 <CarlFK> pollo: buy 2, right?
20:21:27 <pollo> CarlFK: yes
20:21:30 <CarlFK> I think we should talk about SDI cable vs ehternet.  'now'  (I kinda added it to the e-pad, but .. )
20:21:33 <olasd> I might be missing a step but could someone point me at the approval for the video team budget?
20:21:42 <tumbleweed> I could buy http://www.bidorbuy.co.za/item/215789277/Blackmagic_Design_DeckLink_Mini_Recorder.html
20:22:05 <pollo> olasd: we got 5k USD
20:22:06 <CarlFK> anyone know anything about SDI cable?  like should it be hired, bought, constructed...
20:22:11 <olasd> pollo: ack.
20:22:20 <pollo> olasd: but we might go overboard and were told we could bust it
20:22:23 <olasd> heh
20:22:37 <paddatrapper> CarlFK: It can be hired. In lengths up to about 50-70 metres
20:22:41 <pollo> CarlFK: RattusRattus is pretty good with cables
20:22:57 <pollo> I dunno for SDI though
20:23:41 <CarlFK> paddatrapper: good.  I think.  I know daven (who is often here) recommends it over  tcp/cat5
20:23:42 <pollo> tumbleweed: is this the same model?
20:23:43 <tumbleweed> olasd: yeah, whoever buys this should get DPL approval (we'd probably not want to buy it from this year's DC budget)
20:23:47 <tumbleweed> pollo: it appears to be
20:23:54 <p2-mate> SDI uses 75ohm coax
20:24:06 <paddatrapper> It is better as there is no A/D conversion on either side
20:24:09 <p2-mate> so not so difficult to make your own cables
20:24:43 <pollo> tumbleweed: that site list about 50USD more than the other
20:24:50 <CarlFK> can someone confirm we should go SDI from the remote camera to the mixer machine?
20:25:11 <pollo> CarlFK: we can't since we don't know what cameras we can renrt
20:25:20 <tumbleweed> pollo: yes, but it's in ZA
20:26:01 <tumbleweed> hrm, b&h ship to ZA fairly cheaply
20:26:06 <pollo> tumbleweed: I don't get your point: one is 138 USD and the other 180USD (2000ZAR)
20:26:23 <pollo> ohh, I forgot about shipping
20:26:32 <tumbleweed> and customs
20:26:35 <tumbleweed> and delays
20:26:35 <olasd> tumbleweed: you get to pay VAT and mport taxes
20:26:38 <tumbleweed> and VAT
20:26:59 <pollo> well B&H ships free to Canada
20:27:11 <pollo> it can carry them in my luggage to CPT
20:27:18 <tumbleweed> well, if you're volunteering :)
20:27:21 <olasd> mmm
20:27:27 <olasd> where do you want these stored long-term
20:27:34 <tumbleweed> olasd: presumably with you
20:27:45 <pollo> what is the procedure to buy stuff for Debian?
20:27:45 <olasd> because we won't really be able to piggy-back stuff on the irill shipping
20:27:52 <tumbleweed> olasd: I'm going to be sending back opsis boards with you, too
20:27:53 <olasd> if we do the temporary import stuff
20:28:31 <pollo> damn borders are troublesome
20:28:52 <nattie> nations are oppression from the man
20:28:52 <tumbleweed> do a second shipment that's not part of that paperwork?
20:28:55 <DLange> pollo, FYI: my company has a FedEx rate that I can use for DC shipping if this makes any sense. You can drop me the offers in email and I can check Tue how much our rates can carve off.
20:29:14 <pollo> DLange: for IRILL shipping?
20:29:25 <DLange> yes, anything world-wide
20:29:39 <olasd> DLange: very interesting
20:29:54 <pollo> #info DLange can use his company to ship cheaper with FedEx
20:30:08 <pollo> #action pollo to send FedEx rates to DLange
20:30:37 <pollo> olasd: could you take the board with you in your luggages back to France?
20:30:49 <olasd> pollo: yes
20:30:58 <pollo> opsis and bm capture?
20:31:53 <DLange> take the board to Canada again, we'll need it there for DC17, not?
20:31:54 <olasd> yeah
20:32:02 <olasd> DLange: we will need it before
20:32:06 <olasd> in Europe
20:32:07 <pollo> then it is settled
20:32:08 <DLange> (yes I know about Mini-DCs but...)
20:32:11 <olasd> probably in Cambridge for instance
20:32:16 <pollo> #action pollo to buy the 2 bm capture cards
20:32:19 <olasd> or in Lyon
20:32:23 <olasd> :o
20:32:30 <DLange> olasd: buy another one
20:32:33 <pollo> 3?
20:32:36 <pollo> oh, nvm
20:32:45 <pollo> anything else to add in this topic?
20:32:54 <olasd> DLange: it doesn't make sense to scatter the hardware everywhere
20:33:10 <olasd> imho anyway
20:33:32 <DLange> well, with so much development on this still happening it may make sense as an exception
20:33:37 <DLange> but your call, not mine
20:33:58 <pollo> DLange: anyway if vocto works in DC16 we will need more of these
20:34:03 <olasd> it's already hard to know what works when it's all in one place :p
20:34:26 <pollo> #topic cableing
20:34:46 <pollo> we'll need to buy XLR cables or rent them
20:35:04 <tumbleweed> apparently it's normal for equipment hire to include the XLR cables
20:35:15 <paddatrapper> Cables are included in both quotes
20:35:18 <pollo> RattusRattus requested a soldering iron too
20:35:25 <CarlFK> I would rent.  shipping cables around and making sure they work.. is dumb.
20:35:26 <pollo> paddatrapper tumbleweed nice to know
20:35:33 <pollo> #info XLR cables are included in the rentals
20:36:15 <paddatrapper> And there are snakes included too
20:36:22 <tumbleweed> pollo: we're in an electrical engineering depratment :)
20:36:22 <tumbleweed> soldering irons are virtually hanging from the walls
20:36:33 <tumbleweed> that will make RattusRattus very happy
20:36:38 <olasd> I can bring an iron, it might make carrying dev boards around more conspicuous :P
20:36:49 <pollo> #info we will have soldering iron(s)
20:36:50 * tumbleweed has an iron here too
20:37:10 <DLange> tumbleweed: not for clothes... :)
20:37:14 <paddatrapper> As do I
20:37:28 <pollo> can we talk about vocto room cable even though we don't know what cameras we'll use?
20:37:32 <CarlFK> If SDI is best, then that should be the top choice for rent
20:37:46 <pollo> CarlFK: +1
20:37:57 <paddatrapper> Would make life easier
20:38:12 <pollo> how good is HDMI on long distances?
20:38:21 <paddatrapper> It isn't
20:38:28 <p2-mate> not
20:38:37 <paddatrapper> Max of 20M without a boost/conversion
20:38:53 <pollo> the hell. So HDMI is not an option then?
20:38:58 <tumbleweed> why?
20:39:01 <CarlFK> does someone have an idea how long the cable needs to be from remote cam to vocto box?
20:39:33 <pollo> CarlFK: the vocto room is pretty large, If we have a camera at the back it can easily be 60m
20:39:41 <tumbleweed> the rooms aren't that large
20:39:44 <CarlFK> pollo: for hdmi - put the 2nd card in a 2nd box, put the box under the camera.  cat5 like before
20:39:47 <tumbleweed> but 20m probably sin't enough
20:40:30 <CarlFK> but.. I am not sure how many "vocto streams" a single gig-e anything can handle
20:40:39 <paddatrapper> HDMI is also pretty expensive p/m compared to SDI
20:40:40 <CarlFK> i think they are around 400 each.
20:40:43 <pollo> #info HDMI can work (put the 2nd card in a 2nd box, put the box under the camera.  cat5 like before) but it's a hassle and SDI should be prioritised
20:41:18 <pollo> to me this closes the topic. Anything else to add?
20:41:22 <CarlFK> worst case, put a 2nd gig-e nick in the vocto box.  but.. yeah, sdi sounds much better.
20:41:31 <CarlFK> pollo: add SDI cable to the rental thingy
20:41:46 <olasd> the old cameras do SDI too fwiw
20:41:55 <olasd> so long term it sounds sensible
20:42:01 <paddatrapper> I'll ask for it to be added to quotes
20:42:02 <olasd> (the P2HDs)
20:42:04 <tumbleweed> yeah, we can use the two nice debian cameras for the vocto room
20:42:11 <tumbleweed> and the hire cameras in the main talk rooms
20:42:16 <tumbleweed> (if we can only hire hdv)
20:42:46 <p2-mate> or use hdmi 2 sdi convertors?
20:42:55 <pollo> #info old nice Debian Cameras do SDI too, so we can use them if we fail to rent anything else than DV cameras
20:42:58 <tumbleweed> or that. But then we need to buy them
20:43:43 <paddatrapper> So how many SDI cables of what length should I organise?
20:44:04 <pollo> 1 short one (the main is close to the box)
20:44:10 <olasd> one back camera to back of room, one front camera to back of room
20:44:33 <pollo> for the second tumbleweed could check out while checking the PAs?
20:45:06 <tumbleweed> paddatrapper: main talkrooms are the big menzies ones (9 IIRC)
20:45:20 <tumbleweed> so, long enough to get from one corner to the other, around the wall. And some slack
20:45:32 <paddatrapper> OK, so 50m or so should be fine
20:45:43 <CarlFK> short is 2-5m, long is "over 60m"
20:45:47 <pollo> #action paddatrapper to add SDI cables to the rental quotes
20:46:10 <pollo> anything else?
20:46:15 <CarlFK> um.. how long is long?  (03:40:38 PM) pollo: CarlFK: the vocto room is pretty large, If we have a camera at the back it can easily be 60m
20:46:28 <pollo> CarlFK: i was wrong
20:46:35 <CarlFK> k, never mind.
20:46:40 <pollo> pictures are deceiving :p
20:46:48 <CarlFK> well, and I don't know what a m is :p
20:46:54 <pollo> hahaha
20:47:05 <pollo> 3,3 ft
20:47:05 <paddatrapper> CarlFK: Metres lol
20:47:55 <pollo> #topic IRILL Hardware & shipping review
20:48:11 <pollo> looks like I was wrong and we still have time to ship
20:48:19 <p2-mate> meter, the ISO unit for length :)
20:48:56 <pollo> honestly, I think shipping is THE thing that bothers me the most with this whole DC video organising
20:49:37 <olasd> pollo: I was surprised too, but the delays aren't that bad
20:49:55 <pollo> still I'm pretty sure the IRILL list is pretty final: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf16/Videoteam/EquipmentList#Things_we_will_need_to_ship_from_IRILL
20:50:02 <pollo> what do others think about it?
20:50:58 <olasd> sounds tiny
20:51:08 <olasd> so my 1k USD estimation is very very wide
20:51:21 <pollo> olasd: I estimated 900euro back and forth
20:51:33 <olasd> we can cram pretty much everything in the cameras flightcase + the laptops flightcase + the two big tripod pouches
20:51:38 <tumbleweed> throw a bunch of shuko multiplugs in? :)
20:52:04 <olasd> okay, maybe two laptop flight cases :P
20:52:11 <tumbleweed> tally lights?
20:52:27 <olasd> yes, to be added
20:52:27 <pollo> tumbleweed: aren't you going to buy a bunch of plugs like laxst year?
20:52:29 <tumbleweed> flash cards
20:52:44 <olasd> they're in the big cams box but do add to the list too
20:52:47 <tumbleweed> pollo: all our equipment has european plugs on it
20:52:59 <tumbleweed> multiplugs for the same type of socket is useful
20:53:20 <tumbleweed> many many attendees will have them too - they'd be useful for hacklabs
20:53:41 <pollo> tumbleweed: what do you mean by flash cards?
20:53:43 <tumbleweed> we kept them, with the intention of shipping them to future debconfs, to make our life easier
20:53:44 <CarlFK> tumbleweed: cut them off, replace with iec ;)
20:53:47 <olasd> yeah, I'll pad the boxes with multiplugs
20:53:54 <olasd> :)
20:53:55 <tumbleweed> ah, by flash cards I mean the things the talkmeister waves around
20:54:07 <tumbleweed> countdown cards
20:54:11 <pollo> #action pollo to add to the IRILL shipping list: tally lights, multiplugs, cards the talkmeister use
20:54:25 <olasd> do I add the DC13 bathroom sign?
20:54:27 <olasd> :D
20:54:32 <tumbleweed> firewire cables
20:54:41 <pollo> tumbleweed: already there
20:54:42 <tumbleweed> ah, that's on the list
20:54:53 <tumbleweed> yeah, that's good
20:54:54 <pollo> olasd: what was that?
20:54:57 <olasd> zero audio stuff then?
20:55:16 <pollo> olasd: we'll rent it all since we don't have enough anyway
20:55:18 <tumbleweed> we can buy mixers for under R2k
20:55:31 <tumbleweed> (and presumably rent for less)
20:56:06 <paddatrapper> 3 mixers for the duration is about R6k
20:56:10 <tumbleweed> the rest is the right kind of cables, and DI boxes...
20:56:21 <olasd> sorry, I'm arriving late in the process, just making sure the bases have been covered
20:56:24 <olasd> :)
20:56:33 <pollo> olasd: how us the bureaucracy for temp import going?
20:56:38 <DLange> when buying = renting then buy
20:56:48 <DLange> R6k ^
20:56:59 <pollo> DLange: what are we going to do with 3 mixers in CPT?
20:57:04 <tumbleweed> DLange: depends. If renting it means we get all the cables for free...
20:57:05 <olasd> DLange: buying = storing + reshipping + importing + shuffling around
20:57:18 <tumbleweed> it'd need a flight case if we bought it too
20:57:36 <pollo> and for the environment buying is not the best :s
20:57:43 <tumbleweed> olasd: oh, throw 3 male-male XLR barrel connectors in - we usually have to reverse the gender before we get to the camera
20:57:54 <DLange> olasd: just raffle them out. Again same cost -> buy as renting means risk if stuff gets damaged.
20:57:55 <tumbleweed> (and they're tiny)
20:58:03 <olasd> tumbleweed: add to the list
20:58:06 <olasd> :)
20:59:13 <olasd> pollo: I haven't started the bureaucracy for the temp import
20:59:22 <tumbleweed> added to the list
20:59:22 <pollo> olasd: is it a long process?
20:59:27 <olasd> I don't know
20:59:30 <nattie> it's bureaucracy
20:59:34 <olasd> I will call UPS once we have a final list
20:59:43 <DLange> you need to do this with yous s&h anyways
20:59:48 <DLange> (shipper & handler)
21:00:09 <pollo> olasd: I think the list is pretty final
21:00:54 <tumbleweed> DLange: any suggestions on the stuff that we sneaked into ZA not under carnet?
21:01:05 <tumbleweed> just ship it out separately, and see what EU charges us?
21:01:32 <olasd> i'd break it down under the allowances to separate French attendees
21:01:33 <CarlFK> sneak it back out
21:01:40 <DLange> tumbleweed: I'd say ask attendees to carry to Europe and snailmail back to IRILL
21:01:47 <olasd> DLange: yeah
21:02:31 <CarlFK> <- has experience sneaking av gear around Cape Town airport
21:02:36 <tumbleweed> heh
21:02:45 <tumbleweed> he's not lying either
21:03:40 <pollo> well this looks like it concludes the topic
21:04:08 <olasd> CarlFK: *sneaking*?
21:04:10 <olasd> :)
21:04:19 <CarlFK> olasd: avoid ticketing and baggage check, take the big pelican case of cameras to security, they let you to the gate, gate check it.
21:04:28 * DLange has experience snacking at airports <- useless
21:04:40 <olasd> CarlFK: tumbleweed told us the story :P
21:05:02 <pollo> #topic Next meeting
21:05:12 <pollo> I know this was late for some of you
21:05:31 <pollo> and that some people wish to beer on Friday nights
21:05:39 <paddatrapper> Yeah could the next one be earlier? (Even if just by an hour)
21:05:46 <olasd> next week I'll be in the middle of a hackerspace festival so don't count on me anyway
21:06:05 * nattie contemplates festive olasd
21:06:36 <pollo> we could do it next Friday a bit earlier (18:00 to 20:00) if it suits everyone
21:06:53 <paddatrapper> Works for me
21:07:46 <tumbleweed> +1
21:08:49 <pollo> #action pollo to call next meeting on Friday 20th from 18:00 to 20:00 UTC on the ML to see if it's reasonnable
21:08:54 <pollo> #endmeeting