16:02:40 <hellais> #startmeeting OONI gathering 2016-12-12
16:02:40 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Dec 12 16:02:40 2016 UTC.  The chair is hellais. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
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16:03:20 <hellais> ok so here we go: https://pad.riseup.net/p/ooni-irc-pad
16:03:24 <hellais> add your items to the agenda
16:04:56 <agrabeli> hi
16:04:57 <hellais> @Adarsh would you like to start with some updates from the UX front?
16:05:41 <slacktopus> <adarsh> Sure!
16:05:59 <hellais> #topic updates from the OONI UX front
16:07:11 <donald> I want to understand how ooni works to make code. I do not have enough network knowledge. Do you have any recommandation to a book about networking?
16:07:58 <slacktopus> <adarsh> So last week, we focused on creating some new assets for the web UI. Our goals were to simplify the onboarding process, communicate risks more effectively, and streamline the dashboard. On Friday, I met with Maria, Linda, and Arturo to review and finalize these assets. This week, I am going to be interviewing several OONI affiliates to understand what they would like to see next from ooniprobe and OONI as a whole. I am also going to be building
16:07:58 <slacktopus> assets.
16:11:48 <anadahz> adarsh: Great!
16:12:30 <hellais> for more context this is the the redesigned web UI: https://github.com/OpenObservatory/design/blob/master/misc/2016-12-OONI-Redesigned-Web-UI-rev-2.pdf
16:14:05 <irl> the web ui does look rather nice (:
16:14:15 <hellais> this is also the trac page where we have been tracking the redesign work: https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/UX/OoniUiDesign
16:17:37 <hellais> @Adarsh thanks for the update!
16:18:10 <hellais> Also having a minimal style guide is very useful.
16:18:17 <slacktopus> <adarsh> @hellais No problem!
16:19:16 <hellais> @Adarsh something that only just occurred to me now from the style guide, is the colors for the text.
16:19:35 <hellais> Is the text of .copy the same as OONI blue or is it a lighter blue?
16:19:36 <darkk> Looks awesome? Where should I put my useless bikeshedding feedback? :) like -- what timezone should be used to display date/time? should it be consistent UTC (across all probes & measurements.ooni.tpo)? should it be browser-based local timezone?
16:20:06 <darkk> Sorry `Looks awesome?` should be read as `Looks awesome!` :)
16:20:27 <hellais> (also mine I guess is in the bikeshedding domain)
16:20:45 <irl> tor-bikeshed@lists.tpo
16:21:06 <slacktopus> <sbs> irl: lol
16:22:57 <hellais> darkk: imho the timezone in the ooniprobe web UI should be in the format specific to the locale of the browser and in the timezone of the browser.
16:23:14 <hellais> the explorer I think should keep it's current convention of casting things to UTC
16:23:45 * irl agrees, users want things local timezone, but whenever dates/times are stored they should be UTC
16:24:04 <irl> ideally the UI should accept things in UTC from ooniprobe and present local timezone to the user
16:24:10 <irl> in the locale specific format
16:24:25 <hellais> the library we use does this automatically, thouhg as you rightfully pointed out there is a bug in one of the views where it's not properly localised: https://github.com/TheTorProject/ooni-wui/issues/18
16:24:38 <darkk> Yep, it should be_stored_ in UTC, but explorer may show stuff in browser timezone as well
16:25:11 <darkk> I don't know if it's good or not from UI/UX/consistency point of view.
16:25:13 <hellais> (library we use: https://docs.angularjs.org/api/ng/filter/date)
16:25:33 <irl> perhaps we can print timezones next to times?
16:25:37 <irl> to avoid any confusion?
16:29:15 <hellais> I think that for the ooniprobe web UI use case it's fairly natural that the time is localised to the timezone of the browser, so I think omitting the timezone is fine. In explorer where it's a non native timezone we do add the UTC indicator (for example see: http://explorer.ooni.torproject.org/measurement/OevTRGFRWgwAE49qJsuGpYLoMNAHhGPGULWChoeh8nnaC9ofkJ4P36XXpvSD9Of1?input=https:%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwat
16:29:21 <hellais> ch%3Fv%3DYxgnh0lX2rU)
16:29:41 <irl> perhaps we can add a tooltip with the timezone if you hover over the time in the web UI?
16:29:48 <irl> i've seen this done in other places
16:29:53 <irl> can't remember where though
16:30:19 <hellais> irl: ah yes that would be good idea! I think issue #18 would be a good venue where to discuss these improvements.
16:31:00 <hellais> added a note to the ticket about it
16:31:07 <hellais> do we want to move onto the second item
16:31:10 <hellais> ?
16:31:22 <hellais> #topic ooniprobe packages in Debian/Ubuntu update
16:31:25 <irl> ok cool
16:31:46 <irl> so the packages in debian unstable, and deb.tpo {sid, stretch, xenial and yakkety} all work now
16:31:59 <irl> the problem was the ooniprobe.conf was still installed when it was just getting in the way
16:32:33 <irl> this has been removed from the packaging and on upgrade from an older version, it will either delete the file (if no changes were made) or it will move it to ooniprobe.conf.dpkgbackup or something like that
16:32:38 <irl> either way, this will no longer be an issue
16:32:53 <irl> the remaining packages need two backports, python-openssl and python-geoip
16:32:59 <irl> i'll be working on those this evening
16:33:14 <irl> the greenhost servers that have been provisioned are *extremely* useful
16:33:31 <hellais> irl: this is great news! Thank you so much for all of this!
16:33:35 <irl> i now have a workflow where (if no backports are required) i can do a full set of packages in under 2 hours
16:34:02 <irl> i'm hoping to bring that down even futher by using jenkins to perform the builds on the build servers and perform the changelog modifications for each suite
16:34:12 <irl> then i just have to test, sign and upload
16:34:24 <anadahz> irl: excellent thank you!
16:34:33 <localhost> gulag must be destroyed!
16:34:38 <irl> regarding the webui, there is a problem in that webpack is not in debian
16:34:51 <irl> and so the assets must be built outside of debian and included as binary blobs
16:35:02 <irl> this relegates ooniprobe to contrib for now, officially not part of debian
16:35:16 <irl> as time allows, i plan to work on getting the necessary packages to have gulp and webpack available
16:35:23 <irl> and as soon as that happen we can move ooniprobe back to main
16:35:41 <irl> this is a time constrained thing and no other blocking technical issues
16:35:50 <hellais> irl: how are npm dependencies handled?
16:36:00 <hellais> irl: do you also have to have a package for every single npm dependency?
16:36:12 <irl> there will need to be a package for every single npm dependency
16:36:21 <hellais> omg
16:36:23 <irl> so you'll understand why time is an issue here, given i also have a full time job
16:36:55 <hellais> that is kind of crazy though, that debian enforces this sort of procedure to build packages
16:36:59 <irl> for now i'm including the pre-build assets from the ooniprobe git repo, and also including the tagged sources
16:37:04 <irl> from the ooni wui repo
16:37:11 <irl> so it's open source, but it's not includable in debian main
16:37:36 <anadahz> irl: have you checked if there is still an issue with python-txtorcon version 0.17.0-1 and ooniprobe?
16:37:37 <irl> it's not really crazy, it's a good policy, if software hasn't been vetted, don't just go grab it from an untrusted 3rd party source and run it with root
16:38:00 <irl> ah, python-txtorcon did have an issue and i fixed it i think for one suite but forgot to fix it for the others
16:38:17 <irl> basically as i knew that 0.17.0-1 was available, i dropped the version requirement from the requirements.txt
16:38:19 <irl> i think
16:38:29 <irl> then ooniprobe stopped complaining
16:38:38 <irl> there's a bigger underlying issue, but it's a fix that works for now
16:38:42 <irl> again, time constraints
16:39:11 <anadahz> irl: do you host somewhere the code for the Debian build and test scripts?
16:39:11 <hellais> irl: well these deps are javascript dependencies so they are running within the context of a web browser.
16:39:51 <irl> anadahz: https://gitweb.torproject.org/debian/ooniprobe.git/
16:40:10 <irl> hellais: i know, and you're welcome to join the bikeshed at debian-js-bikeshed@lists.debian.org
16:40:34 <irl> the policy is the policy and for good enough reasons that we need to think carefully if it's going to be changed
16:40:49 <irl> the big issue is that node.js is a language that forgot to have a standard library
16:40:54 <anadahz> irl: re python-txtorcon 0.17.0-1 isn't going to be installed by default if a user has the tpo deb repo setup?
16:41:06 <irl> anadahz: it should be
16:41:18 <irl> i'll double check that later today
16:41:45 <irl> ooooh
16:41:51 <irl> i didn't do backports for ubuntu
16:41:55 <irl> adding those to the list
16:42:13 <anadahz> Though this version produces a version compare conflict: pkg_resources.ContextualVersionConflict: (txsocksx 0.0.0 (/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages), Requirement.parse('txsocksx>=1.13.0'), set(['txtorcon']))
16:42:32 <anadahz> (full log in https://github.com/TheTorProject/ooni-probe/issues/693)
16:42:43 <irl> yep, i'll be double checking all of this
16:43:08 <irl> i'll see how far i can get, tomorrow i'll not be doing much (flying to romania) but then next week i will finish off anything that remains
16:43:11 <irl> i've seen the log
16:43:26 <anadahz> So in my case I needed to downgrade to python-txtorcon=0.11.0-1 to make ooniprobe happy.
16:43:43 <anadahz> irl: thx!
16:43:59 <irl> (:
16:44:28 <irl> ok, i told my boss i couldn't meet with him as the ooni meeting was scheduled, but i should run now and see what he wanted
16:44:37 <irl> i will update the github issue #693 with progress
16:44:47 <hellais> irl: hehe, ok. If there is a list I can share some of my dissatisfaction with the debian policy related to js packages I will :P
16:45:08 <irl> hellais: i'll see if i can find the thread, but debian-devel@ has had a lot of it
16:45:25 <hellais> irl: when do you think the packages for jessie and trusty will be uploaded?
16:46:06 <hellais> (also https://github.com/TheTorProject/ooni-probe/issues/695 is the master ticket for release 2.1.0 that includes the ticks for jessie and trusty)
16:46:19 <hellais> irl: ok cool I will inspect that!
16:49:23 <hellais> random search yielded this: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/11/msg00843.html (seems like somebody is already looking into packaging webpack)
16:50:17 <hellais> do we have anything else to discuss this week?
16:51:24 * sbs crickets
16:52:29 <darkk> any news regarding OONI "published" for the stores (Play Market & AppStore)
16:52:34 <darkk> *publisher
16:52:57 <darkk> I mean usage of "Tor Project, Inc." vs. having separate account.
16:55:56 <hellais> yeah I briefly looked into the option of publishing it under a separate account and it seems like Apple has a fairly strict policy for app store inclusion
16:56:18 <hellais> like you need to be a legally recognised entity and have DUNS number and a bunch of other stuff
16:57:40 <hellais> I still need to follow up with tor people to learn if it's possible to publish under the android account of tpo and create an account for Apple for tor
16:58:46 <hellais> that said it seems like both apple and google play support transfering apps from an account to the other and you don't loose installations or reviews so even if we are to publish it under one our personal accounts and migrate it later it's not a big deal
16:59:12 <hellais> (the only caveat is that you can't do it if you integrate with iCloud or Passbook, which I guess we don't)
16:59:47 <darkk> ah, that's good news. I thought, that the transfer is impossible due to code signing key being coupled with both the app and the account.
17:01:23 <hellais> I think you have to republish a new App signed with the new key, but you don't loose users or reviews which is good
17:01:42 <hellais> nuke: is this consistent with your experience?
17:02:13 <darkk> are old-key-and-app -> new-key-and-app updates seamless?
17:02:54 <hellais> darkk: from what the documentation and comments on stackoverflow, yes
17:04:50 <hellais> https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/LanguagesUtilities/Conceptual/iTunesConnect_Guide/Chapters/TransferringAndDeletingApps.html
17:05:32 <hellais> https://support.google.com/googleplay/android-developer/answer/6230247?hl=en
17:07:45 <darkk> I'm glad that it's possible nowadays. Sorry, https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/6b/c8/85/6bc885fc0edbd78f67314930d671c3fd.jpg
17:08:16 <hellais> do we have more items to discuss talk about?
17:09:02 <darkk> EOF
17:09:22 <hellais> sounds good
17:09:25 <hellais> #endmeeting