16:59:41 <phw> #startmeeting anti-censorship meeting
16:59:41 <MeetBot> Meeting started Thu Oct 24 16:59:41 2019 UTC.  The chair is phw. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:59:41 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
16:59:45 <phw> hi everyone!
16:59:48 <cohosh> hi
16:59:53 <phw> here's our meeting pad: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-censorship-2019-keep
17:00:00 <gaba> hi!
17:00:40 <phw> let's get started with our gettor item
17:00:49 <phw> hmm, is this from last week?
17:01:14 <gaba> no
17:01:19 <gaba> i updated the roadmap
17:01:26 <gaba> moved it into the gettor group
17:01:33 <gaba> (instead of just in one of its projects)
17:02:04 <gaba> hiro needs a roadmap that she can follow when working on stuff (the same with cohosh I guess)
17:02:35 <cohosh> thanks gaba
17:03:14 <gaba> now that board is sync with trac (as from last week)
17:03:27 <phw> nice, thanks gaba!
17:03:48 <gaba> we can close tickets in dip and tickets in trac when done
17:05:39 <phw> is there anything specific that we should be discussing wrt the roadmap?
17:06:11 <gaba> mostly check that you agree with the prioritization of issues
17:07:17 <cohosh> looks good to me from here
17:07:53 <gaba> ok
17:08:10 <cohosh> i see a duplicate of #27330 in the icebox and in next
17:08:19 <gaba> hiro is going to connect soon and can also check
17:08:24 <gaba> we can move to next topic
17:08:32 <gaba> ahh, sorry. I will close one of those duplicates
17:08:33 <cohosh> cool \o/
17:09:41 <phw> looks fine to me. i hope we can get to #31982 soon because it's user-facing
17:09:58 <phw> ...and i think it's more important than gettor's twitter bot
17:10:23 <hiro> hi
17:10:30 <hiro> sorry some issues with timezones
17:10:37 <phw> but i see that it's at the top of the backlog, so that's great :)
17:10:52 <gaba> we can move it to next and get #27330 back into backlog
17:11:37 <gaba> there are some tickets in next like #28232 that may be ready to close but we need to check it
17:11:43 <gaba> hiro: https://dip.torproject.org/groups/torproject/anti-censorship/gettor-project/-/boards?scope=all&utf8=%E2%9C%93&state=opened
17:13:32 <hiro> yes I can review the board and close what has been done
17:13:42 <hiro> while also updating everything that I have been working on with its status
17:13:49 <phw> thanks hiro
17:14:25 <hiro> no worries
17:15:00 <gaba> cohosh: you are going to take also some tasks from gettor?
17:15:05 <cohosh> i can do that yeah
17:15:08 <gaba> is there anything you need from hiro or phw or me about it?
17:15:12 <cohosh> i was just taking a look
17:15:29 <cohosh> and it looks like a lot of them require access to things i don't have access to
17:15:36 <cohosh> but i'll take some time and look through the code related ones
17:15:59 <cohosh> i'll reach out later with specific questions
17:16:00 <gaba> can we have a 1:1 between hiro and you to transfer some access/knowledge here?
17:16:03 <gaba> ok
17:16:20 <cohosh> that might be good, and a survival guide for how to update things
17:16:25 <cohosh> not sure if there's a ticket for that
17:16:34 <arma2> and once you hear the survival guide, write it down for the next person :)
17:16:43 <phw> there's #31377
17:16:54 <cohosh> ah nice
17:17:01 <gaba> #31377 is in the icebox
17:17:04 <cohosh> there's a spot for it on the wiki: https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/org/teams/AntiCensorshipTeam/GetTorSurvivalGuide
17:17:05 <hiro> I have been documenting everything in the readme, but I have recently cleaned up all that virtualenv things
17:17:06 <gaba> we can move it to the next thing we do
17:17:13 <cohosh> okay maybe i'll pick up that one first heh
17:17:36 <hiro> so it can very well be rewritten... I can do that tomorrow so you have it
17:18:01 <cohosh> oh sure, i don't want to rush it if you have other things you need to move forward on
17:18:12 <cohosh> but that would be helpful for knowledge transfer
17:18:39 <hiro> this happened these two last weeks while rebuilding the machine so that's why the readme became obsolete
17:18:40 <cohosh> thanks hiro!
17:18:45 <cohosh> ah okay
17:18:50 <phw> i think the survival guide is a great ticket to start with
17:20:05 <hiro> phw what about I do the survival guide and cohosh could start to see where the code could be imporvd and add some more test coverage?
17:20:21 <hiro> I haven't have time to test all those twisted callbacks
17:20:25 <hiro> only unit testing
17:20:48 <hiro> maybe some of those callbacks aren't even needed (these is baggage from how it was written)
17:20:49 <cohosh> sounds good to me
17:21:19 <gaba> cohosh will need the survival guide to start and she can review it and ask questions to be sure everything needed is there
17:21:32 <phw> hiro: that works too. i figured cohosh would be a good person for the survival guide because she's new to gettor and it'll be easy to see what needs documenting, and how.
17:21:43 <phw> you, however, are a veteran :)
17:21:52 <cohosh> but that can also be a review and iteration on the survival guide as gaba said
17:22:03 <phw> yes, that works
17:22:41 <hiro> yeah I think that works... so as I do the survival guide I can get all the needed access
17:23:10 <phw> sounds good
17:23:34 <phw> are we done with gettor?
17:24:07 <cohosh> this all sounds good to me
17:24:20 <gaba> yes
17:24:41 <phw> ok, #29206 / turbotunnel is next
17:24:50 <phw> cohosh, can you take this item?
17:25:00 <cohosh> sure i guess this is a question i have for dcf
17:25:11 <cohosh> whether it makes sense to continue working on #29206 separately
17:25:28 <cohosh> or to start moving towards the work that's been done with turbo tunnel
17:25:59 <dcf1> I think it still makes sense to do #39306 unless you're not motivated to.
17:26:13 <dcf1> turbo tunnel in snowflake is at least a couple of months off, I reckon
17:26:23 <cohosh> ok, i'm happy to keep working on it
17:26:34 <cohosh> it will be good to have something in the meantime
17:26:58 <dcf1> and not even as a reusable library at that point, I intend the Snowflake integration to help inform requirements as to what would be needed for something like that
17:27:29 <cohosh> ok neat, i left some comments about that on the turbo tunnel post
17:27:32 <dcf1> sorry about #29207, I have overextended myself as usual
17:27:40 <cohosh> not sure if that's the best place for them
17:28:18 <cohosh> dcf1: it's ok about the reviews, how do you feel about me reaching out to phw for reviews on some of these larger changes
17:28:22 <cohosh> and how does phw feel about that as well?
17:28:51 <cohosh> the answer can also be that we should be ok with moving slowly
17:28:57 <dcf1> it's ok with me
17:29:57 <phw> cohosh: i'm fine with this. the first few iterations will probably take a while, and i'll have plenty of questions but it's a good opportunity for me to get more involved in the snowflake protocol
17:29:58 <arma2> historically i have been a fan of modularity in pluggable transport components, and historically the modularity goals have shown us that putting together the puzzle pieces was harder than we first hoped
17:30:09 <arma2> (like, remember back in the day when we thought it'd be cool to treat each PT as a pipe and you can layer them)
17:30:12 <cohosh> phw: awesome, thanks!
17:30:43 <arma2> so, modularity looks appealing here too ("leave the reliability layer to turbo tunnel), and is probably more complex than it first seems.
17:31:32 <cohosh> arma2: that is the eventual goal, we're hoping having #29206 in snowflake in the meantime will help with some more urgent network health issues
17:31:53 <cohosh> like right now it takes a long time to recover from getting a bad snowflake
17:32:09 <cohosh> and it looks like your connection to the tor network is just failing
17:32:20 <phw> arma2: that was fog, no? i think there was a trac comment with a few "lessons learned" somewhere
17:32:37 <arma2> keen. i would say that if you hadn't started on it, you should work toward turbo tunnel integration. but since there is a thing, and it kind of works, we can put something in place for users sooner rather than later, and also gain intuition and experience in the area, so sounds good
17:32:48 * cohosh learns about fog
17:32:48 <arma2> phw: yes, fog was one piece of that
17:33:01 <arma2> fog is spelled with the font that makes it clear it's f(g(x))
17:33:24 <cohosh> lol good name
17:33:32 <hiro> lol
17:33:48 * arma2 backs away so he doesn't sidetrack the meeting
17:33:59 <cohosh> ok that answers my question
17:34:53 <phw> cohosh: anything else wrt #29206?
17:34:57 <phw> or should we move on?
17:35:02 <cohosh> i'm good
17:35:04 <cohosh> thanks
17:35:43 <phw> the last discussion item is mine. i created some bridgedb usage metrics visualisations in #32135 and wanted to ask y'all, what other visualisations you would like to see
17:36:37 <phw> oh, and on a related note. i took a look at the request headers that bridgedb sees for moat requests. unfortunately, there's no "moat-ip", which meek-server is supposed to add afaik
17:36:56 <phw> so i wonder if our apache removes it somehow. somebody suspected so in an old ticket.
17:37:08 <cohosh> these look really nice!
17:37:15 <arma2> the 'apache removes it' theory is a solid one
17:37:24 <arma2> since i think we proxypass or something to bridgedb, right?
17:38:20 <phw> arma2: i'm not sure, the details are complex. sysrqb once did a comprehensive writeup of the setup and may know
17:38:47 <arma2> ProxyPass /meek/
17:38:47 <arma2> ProxyPass /moat/
17:38:48 <arma2> yes we do
17:39:01 <arma2> see /etc/apache2/sites-enabled/bridges.torproject.org.conf
17:39:25 <dcf1> "moat-ip" is only for Google App Engine, so no surprise that it doesn't appear.
17:39:49 <dcf1> Azure CDN is supposed to always add X-Forwarded-For unless you specifically disable it https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/cdn/cdn-verizon-premium-rules-engine-reference-features#proxy-special-headers
17:40:36 <phw> i see. from bridgedb's PoV, x-forwarded-for is always
17:40:49 <phw> i'm not sure what happens with the header before bridgedb sees it
17:40:54 <dcf1> x-forwarded-for is supposed to be a chain though. The CDN's XFF should be in it too.
17:41:18 <dcf1> https://gitweb.torproject.org/pluggable-transports/meek.git/tree/meek-server/useraddr.go#n10
17:42:18 <dcf1> #13171 is background on XFF and Meek-IP
17:42:42 <phw> that's useful, thanks
17:43:10 <dcf1> Meek-IP/Moat-IP only exists because at least at the time, App Engine didn't set XFF nor allow an app to set it.
17:43:49 <dcf1> hmm actually maybe I know what's going on.
17:43:52 <phw> ok, so the next step should be to figure out what happens to the XFF chain and why bridgedb only sees
17:43:58 <dcf1> Let me think and check with you after the meeting.
17:44:11 <phw> ok, thanks!
17:46:13 <phw> it would be good to see client addresses because i'd like to know how many moat requests come from tor.
17:46:30 <phw> recall that all our bot requests for the https distributor are coming over tor
17:47:49 <arma2> all of the moat requests ought to come from tor, right? since tor browser ought to send them over tor
17:48:09 <arma2> oh
17:48:14 <arma2> no that is a very wrong statement. carry on.
17:49:11 <phw> shall we move on to our 'needs help with' sections?
17:50:25 <phw> hmm, i wonder if bridgedb has a separate distribution bucket for moat-over-tor.
17:50:30 <phw> like it does for https-over-tor.
17:52:00 <phw> ok, cohosh has #29206, #29207, #31310, #32131
17:52:09 <phw> dcf has #31890
17:52:25 <phw> i have #32105, #31874
17:52:29 <dcf1> still waiting for confirmation from sina
17:52:54 <phw> last week he replied "On top! Sorry for the late reply!" but nothing has changed on the ticket :/
17:53:07 <phw> i suppose it's time for the weekly reminder
17:53:45 <cohosh> phw: can you take #31310 and #32131?
17:54:15 <phw> cohosh: yes
17:54:53 <dcf1> I'm doing #32131.
17:54:59 <dcf1> Commenting on it anyway.
17:55:00 <cohosh> ah thanks
17:55:23 * phw reverts the reviewer field of #32131
17:56:08 <phw> cohosh: do you have time to take a look at #32105 and #31874?
17:56:57 <cohosh> yep!
17:57:02 <phw> thanks
17:57:27 <phw> do we have a reviewer for #29206 and #29207?
17:57:43 <dcf1> it's me
17:58:04 <dcf1> but this is where I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed so if another wants to look too, it would be appreciated.
17:59:59 <phw> dcf1: i may be able to take one of these on. i'll coordinate with cohosh and let you know, ok?
18:00:35 <dcf1> ok
18:00:56 <phw> that should be it for today, just in time
18:01:04 <phw> thanks everyone
18:01:08 <cohosh> thanks!
18:01:09 <phw> #endmeeting