15:59:41 <shelikhoo> #startmeeting tor anti-censorship meeting
15:59:41 <MeetBot> Meeting started Thu Apr 14 15:59:41 2022 UTC.  The chair is shelikhoo. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
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15:59:58 <shelikhoo> here is our meeting pad: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-anti-censorship-keep
16:00:26 <shelikhoo> feel free to add what you've been working on and put items you want to talk in the agenda
16:00:29 <shelikhoo> hi~
16:00:33 <cohosh> hi!
16:01:04 <keroserene> hi all
16:02:27 <arma2> i just added "Roger is working on a Defcon talk submission, around the Russia censorship thing. Soon it will be ready for internal feedback and then we'll submit it."
16:02:45 <arma2> let me know if you are a person who is interested in looking at the draft and giving feedback :)
16:03:08 <dcf1> I would like to see it.
16:03:15 <shelikhoo> Yes, please let me have a look at the draft
16:03:16 <arma2> ( https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/anti-censorship/team/-/issues/73 )
16:03:25 <cohosh> nice arma2, i'm also interested
16:03:41 <arma2> great
16:03:59 <keroserene> as well :)
16:06:01 <shelikhoo> okay I didn't see any change at the pad, let move to the discussion part
16:06:21 <shelikhoo> [Distributed Snowflake Server Support](https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/anti-censorship/pluggable-transports/snowflake/-/issues/40129) is ready for testing
16:06:35 <shelikhoo> Right now the go part of the code is working
16:06:55 <shelikhoo> so we can start to setup a testing broker
16:07:05 <shelikhoo> run some testing proxy
16:07:23 <cohosh> :o cool!
16:07:34 <shelikhoo> and then load the broker with secondary bridge info
16:08:54 <shelikhoo> It is already working in docker compose, but real world testing is needed
16:09:19 <cohosh> so the idea is to run this test broker for a while to catch any bugs/pain points for deploying on the production broker?
16:09:22 <shelikhoo> i won't be surprised if we discover new bug when we run it on internet
16:09:26 <shelikhoo> yes
16:10:19 <shelikhoo> we also need some real non-default snowflake server(bridges)
16:10:46 <shelikhoo> I would advise we try to run one of them in asia too see if that help with speed in china
16:11:06 <shelikhoo> since it is related to s96
16:11:32 <shelikhoo> I would advise we try to run one of them in asia to see if that help with speed in china
16:12:12 <cohosh> yea that's a good idea
16:13:38 <shelikhoo> I would recommend to try Japan, Taiwan, South Korea.... but that choice is the bridge operator's
16:14:01 <keroserene> I am in the process of spinning up another snowflake bridge, let's talk about it in detail
16:14:13 <keroserene> the geosharding method will be good to discuss
16:14:40 <shelikhoo> yes, all snowflake traffic will need to be send to the server to be convert to tor traffic
16:15:17 <shelikhoo> so if we run the bridge in Europe, then the traffic must make a trip to Europe
16:15:21 <shelikhoo> which can be slow
16:15:47 <gaba> maybe the guardian project would be interested in running a bridge in asia
16:15:56 <gaba> we can reach out to them once is ready for testing
16:16:23 <ggus> ^^ yes
16:16:34 <arma2> our friends in taipei could probably help too (contact via pellaeon)
16:16:34 <keroserene> +1
16:17:59 <gaba> arma2 can you reach out to the,?
16:18:02 <gaba> them*
16:18:16 <shelikhoo> Yes, currently we need to run some internal testing first... I think dcf1 is working on setting up a secondary bridge, is there any progress?
16:18:36 <gaba> and kerosene too.
16:19:12 <arma2> if somebody gives me text to forward, yes. or i can give somebody pellaeon's contact info
16:19:21 <dcf1> I haven't started installing the bridge from https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/anti-censorship/pluggable-transports/snowflake/-/issues/40122 yet. I can start next week if you are ready to start testing with it.
16:19:30 <arma2> there's a whole group of people there that are tor-positive. i did a talk to them in 2019 before the covid mess.
16:19:35 <dcf1> This bridge is in the USA
16:19:46 <keroserene> I had a good chat w/ nathan @ guardian the other day.  they are already onboard to support in many ways, the overall snowflake network, yes let's push that thread forward
16:20:12 <shelikhoo> dcf1: Yes, I think I can get the testing broker working by the end of next week
16:20:37 <dcf1> ok
16:20:40 <gaba> ok. So we start testing with your new second bridge dcf1?
16:20:48 <gaba> and we reach out to orgs after that test
16:20:48 <shelikhoo> the location isn't that important yet, and US isn't a bad choice either.
16:22:35 <shelikhoo> Yes. I think we might wants to invest in creating a automatic way to setup the snowflake bridge. if we reach out to other org, they might not be able to configure load balanced tor + snowflake server easily
16:23:05 <gaba> ok
16:23:38 <shelikhoo> we can discuss in later, but right now configure a load balanced tor + snowflake server is not trivial
16:24:36 <shelikhoo> i will create a ticket about this
16:25:42 <shelikhoo> okay, I think this is everything about this topic from me, is there anything else from others?
16:25:59 <shelikhoo> about this topic
16:27:58 <shelikhoo> okay this is the end of our meeting agenda, did I missed anything in this meeting?
16:29:15 <cohosh> do we want to choose another reading group topic?
16:30:02 <shelikhoo> +1 Yes
16:30:29 <cohosh> i'm interested in this: https://github.com/net4people/bbs/issues/108
16:30:36 <cohosh> but i'm not sure if there's enough for a reading group there
16:33:18 <shelikhoo> I think we can have it, let's make a fiat paper....
16:33:38 <shelikhoo> I think we can have it, let's make it a fiat paper....
16:33:53 <shelikhoo> is there any objections?
16:34:15 <shelikhoo> or better options?
16:34:54 <cohosh> there's also this: https://github.com/net4people/bbs/issues/105 might interesting to look into
16:36:16 <cohosh> let's just discuss the quic blocking, it can be a short group if there's not much to discuss
16:37:02 <keroserene> yes, curious what's going on with QUIC
16:38:49 <shelikhoo> Okay, I think we can move with a reading group session for QUIC blocking in russia issue
16:39:26 <shelikhoo> anything else for this meeting?
16:39:56 <cohosh> not from me
16:40:53 <shelikhoo> EOF
16:41:08 <keroserene> so I just got a message from greatfire. they have in depth feedback on snowflake, and are interested in doing the GF+snowflake collab
16:42:26 <shelikhoo> keroserene: do you wish to discuss this in the meeting, or share the content of feedback with us so that we can discuss it later?
16:42:43 <shelikhoo> keroserene: do you wish to discuss this in the meeting, or share the content of feedback so that we can discuss it later?
16:44:14 <keroserene> if people are interested, I can share the feedback now.  otherwise I can also do a specific discussion w/ those interested, and we'll bring an update to the next mtg
16:45:26 <cohosh> can you share it publicly?
16:45:46 <cohosh> like in an issue or email?
16:47:00 <keroserene> it's just one large signal message, so I will ask if they're ok with it being passed along.  otherwise I can summarize the parts that are fine in an issue
16:47:19 <cohosh> cool, thanks!
16:50:20 <shelikhoo> Okay, anything more for this meeting? If none I will end this meeting in 2 mins
16:51:14 <cohosh> thanks shelikhoo!
16:52:04 <shelikhoo> #endmeeting