15:58:37 <donuts> #startmeeting UX Team Weekly Meeting, 13 June 2023
15:58:38 <MeetBot> Meeting started Tue Jun 13 15:58:37 2023 UTC.  The chair is donuts. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
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15:58:43 <donuts> hello hello
15:58:48 <championquizzer> hello! o/
15:58:51 <sweetcurator[m]> hey!
15:58:52 <nicob> howdy o/
15:58:57 <nah> o/
15:59:03 <donuts> welcome everyone
15:59:05 <donuts> pad is here, as always: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-ux-team-keep
15:59:13 <donuts> please add anything you'd like to discuss today to the agenda
16:00:25 <donuts> quick announcements: the deadline to feed back on the 4-day workweek is June 16th
16:01:05 <donuts> and both Tor Browser 12.0.7 and 12.5a7 were released last week
16:01:28 <donuts> 12.5a7 in particular contains a bunch of front-end updates planned for the 12.5 stable release, so please test it if you can!
16:01:45 <nicob> woo! I started using it yesterday
16:02:10 <donuts> \o/
16:02:33 <donuts> I've found a few issues that I've created tickets for so far
16:02:37 <donuts> i.e. here: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/applications/tor-browser/-/issues
16:03:21 <donuts> Okay, if no-one else has any announcements please feel free to take a few minutes to update your todo lists
16:03:27 <donuts> and let me know when you're ready :)
16:04:06 <nicob> ready
16:04:11 <championquizzer> me too!
16:05:57 <donuts> Oh, there was one important announcement I completely missed
16:06:10 <donuts> our new product designer should hopefully be starting in a week or so!
16:06:19 <donuts> proper introductions to come after they start :)
16:06:26 <nicob> yay! \o/
16:06:29 <nah> wohoo!!
16:06:48 <championquizzer> \o/
16:07:00 <sweetcurator[m]> nice
16:07:04 <donuts> nah: are you all done with the pad?
16:07:14 <nah> yess!
16:08:28 <donuts> okay I don't see anything in bold, however I'd love to know how rightscon went nah! also if you could tell us any more about the green screen coalition?
16:09:25 <nah> sure!
16:09:49 <nah> rightscon was very great!
16:09:58 <nah> and very intense. hehe
16:10:20 <nah> tor people had a booth on thursday -- that i couldn't attend due to food poisioning :(
16:10:38 <donuts> oh nooo
16:10:41 <championquizzer> oh no :/
16:10:45 <donuts> i hope you're feeling better now
16:11:00 <nicob> oh nooo
16:11:06 <nicob> the worst
16:11:09 <nah> and many sessions. i attended to most sessions involving methodologies and technologies in the intersection of global south and feminist approaches
16:11:35 <nah> i'm started feeling better only this morning :/ unfortunately many ppl had the same issue as i
16:12:21 <nah> some of our partners from global south projects were around, so it was good to get in touch with them
16:12:28 <nah> and other tor collaborators
16:12:34 <donuts> that's good :)
16:13:17 <donuts> how did your session go?
16:13:57 <nah> our session was hybrid and invite only to reimagine whatsapp. we created 3 scenarios and divided the participants into groups
16:14:03 <nah> 2 in person groups, 1 only group
16:14:35 <nah> to discuss the scenarios and how a messaging app could respond better in those moments
16:14:47 <nah> like when you're receiving an unwanted message/picture
16:15:00 <nah> or when you're getting spammed on purpose
16:15:24 <nah> it was fun and creative. we plan to do it again before publicizing a report
16:15:33 <nah> on the green screen coalition, funders and climate crises researchers, organizations and practitioners met to discuss strategies to combat climate crises
16:15:39 <donuts> that's interesting! i'm looking forward to seeing the report
16:16:00 <nah> in the perspective of technology, digital infrastructure and digital rights
16:16:24 <nah> we were around ~50 people during the whole weekend
16:16:46 <donuts> :o
16:16:47 <donuts> wow
16:16:51 <gaba> that sounds great nah
16:16:57 <nah> each participant should choose a track to participate, i was at sustainable and equitable digital infrastructure
16:17:44 <nah> that was facilitated by a person from the engine room
16:18:06 <nah> when the report from this session is ready, i can also share (i'll check if it's possible to share publicly)
16:18:15 <gaba> yes please
16:18:16 <nah> but this coalition intends to continue
16:18:33 <nah> another meeting is being planned to happen in september, probably in east africa (not sure yet)
16:18:56 <nah> they are also planning to launch a funding
16:19:01 <nah> likely public!
16:19:12 <donuts> that's awesome
16:19:16 <nicob> this all sounds awesome
16:19:47 <nah> i can say it was very energizing -- although i was feeling a bit ill hehe
16:20:29 <donuts> i'm sure, please take the time you need to rest-up this week :)
16:20:36 <donuts> also thank you for sharing nah!
16:20:44 <nah> thank you! :)
16:20:53 <championquizzer> thanks for the updates, nah!
16:21:31 <donuts> championquizzer: I have "12.5 release coordination" in the agenda for the end of the meeting, but do you have any non-12.5 related updates you'd like to share first?
16:21:53 <donuts> I noticed your report has ARROWS 👀
16:21:55 <championquizzer> yes! last week published the May user support report: https://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/tor-project/2023-June/003633.html
16:22:00 <championquizzer> ha, donuts
16:22:04 <championquizzer> thanks to you
16:22:14 <donuts> looks beautiful
16:22:51 <donuts> nah: i'm not sure if you were around when we discussed this last time? but the arrows are to indicate the trend since the last report
16:23:01 <donuts> because I always forget the context for the numbers
16:23:16 <nicob> ooh thats interesting to know re: arrows
16:23:26 <nah> donuts: thank you
16:23:46 <nah> interesting!
16:24:18 <championquizzer> Telegram, as always, is still the most popular channel followed by email
16:25:27 <championquizzer> regarding this issue https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/applications/tor-browser-build/-/issues/40822
16:25:50 <championquizzer> i believe we are still getting tickets because the windows installer on our website is on 12.0.4
16:26:32 <donuts> right
16:26:36 <championquizzer> s/is/was
16:27:03 <donuts> should be fixed now i believe, as of 12.0.7
16:27:31 <championquizzer> yep! no new reports
16:27:35 <donuts> awesome :)
16:28:56 <donuts> I don't have any questions this month, thanks championquizzer – I know the situation in CN has potentially changed but I'll get up to speed on that at the next S96 meeting
16:29:28 <championquizzer> sounds good!
16:30:14 <donuts> nah, this reminds me – gus has been collecting feedback about conjure on the forum here: https://forum.torproject.net/t/call-for-testers-help-the-tor-project-to-test-conjure-on-tor-browser-alpha/7815
16:30:28 <donuts> we'll need to do the same thing for webtunnel at some point too
16:30:36 <donuts> both are going to remain in alpha only for the time being
16:31:20 <donuts> atm you can test both by pasting a bridge line manually in alpha
16:31:24 <nah> added to my radar
16:31:45 <donuts> thanks!
16:31:46 <nah> donuts: and this one? https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/anti-censorship/lox-rs/-/issues/12#note_2909223
16:31:58 <donuts> yes but we're still a long ways away from doing that
16:32:07 <nah> ok!
16:32:09 <donuts> it'll be a 2024 thing at this rate
16:32:29 <donuts> the plan is to have an MVP version in alpha by the end of January, and then we'll collect feedback after
16:33:09 <donuts> however there are some other things we'll probably want to collect feedback on via the forum like onion services POW and conflux
16:33:21 <donuts> which are coming down the network pipeline
16:34:12 <nah> soon?
16:34:42 <donuts> can't remember the exact timelines, soonish I think 😅
16:34:46 <donuts> before lox
16:34:51 <nah> hehe ok!
16:35:10 <nah> i have something else to share
16:35:15 <donuts> go for it
16:35:52 <nah> before going to rightscon i share the snowflake user research report that was conducted in east africa
16:35:58 <nah> here is the link: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/ux/research/-/issues/103#note_2907939
16:37:05 <nah> we might receive two other reports in the future, but since this sponsor 9 phase is completed, we can consider this report for next steps. it's a result of 5 usability testings each
16:37:09 <nah> that have similar finds:
16:37:32 <nah> - participants in the testing don't understand the explanation in the website
16:37:52 <nah> - participants don't understand the difference between proxy and client
16:38:06 <nah> - participants think that the main illustration is confusing
16:38:17 <nah> - they also mention there is too much information in the webpage
16:38:28 <nah> (and too technical)
16:39:07 <nah> sorry, i shared*
16:39:25 <donuts> thank you! I forwarded what you have so far to AshishSoni[m] who's working on the new page
16:39:47 <nah> great! thank you :)
16:40:04 <donuts> AshishSoni[m]: this makes a good case to find more human language other than client vs proxy and consider a lighter volume of information overall too :)
16:40:36 <AshishSoni[m]> will consider this!!
16:40:45 <donuts> thank you!
16:41:00 <nah> thank you AshishSoni[m]!
16:41:07 <donuts> okay I have one more item on the agenda for today: 12.5 release coordination
16:41:27 <donuts> 12.5 is currently scheduled for tuesday the 20th
16:41:36 <donuts> however as always it can be a day or two or three late
16:42:13 <donuts> I'm working on the release post atm, nicob is working on assets, and I see championquizzer is working on manual updates :D
16:42:34 <championquizzer> yes! :)
16:42:37 <donuts> we have a rapid followup release (12.5.1) scheduled for July 5th to take care of any issues too
16:43:23 <donuts> any questions folks? or is everyone clear with this one?
16:44:19 <nicob> all good here! donuts do you think you'll have time to take a peek at the 12.5 visuals so far in figma today? tagged you in figma but I know notifications there can be wonky
16:45:36 <donuts> i have thank you! let's catch up later this afternoon if you're around?
16:45:53 <nicob> yeah i'm around!
16:46:15 <donuts> awesome, i kind of took elements from several of your routes and mashed them together but idk
16:46:29 <nah> all good here! let me know if i can assist on something else :) re: 12.5
16:46:32 <donuts> i'll ping you when i'm back from lunch and we can strategize ^^
16:46:34 <donuts> thanks nah :)
16:46:52 <championquizzer> next week we also have the forum migration, so comments on the release blog post might be disabled for a little while. i was wondering how that affects getting feedback post-release
16:47:03 <donuts> oh interesting
16:47:07 <donuts> thanks for bringing that up
16:47:11 <championquizzer> https://forum.torproject.net/t/self-hosting-the-tor-project-users-forum/7914
16:47:32 <donuts> maybe we should delay the release until the 21st then
16:47:55 <donuts> do you know how much downtime there'll be?
16:47:59 <championquizzer> i believe the forum will be read-only during the migration and offline for some time after that
16:49:17 <donuts> let's see if we can make a wild richard appear
16:49:24 <richard> *pop*
16:49:30 <donuts> hello ^^
16:49:37 <richard> who disturb my slumber
16:49:41 <donuts> championquizzer mentions that the forum migration is due to happen on the 20th
16:49:49 <donuts> and could mess with 12.5 stable feedback
16:50:05 <donuts> what do you think about skipping the 20th entirely, and releasing from the 21st instead?
16:50:09 <richard> I thought the migration was all backend stuffs?
16:50:20 <richard> oh yeah that's fine
16:50:27 <gaba> hey, we could move the migration for after
16:50:30 <gaba> if that will help
16:50:36 <gaba> any time before the end of the month
16:50:42 <richard> we'll probably buil overnight on Tuesday anyway, sign+release Wednesday
16:51:05 <donuts> okay we should be cool then, I don't think we need to hold the forum up but ty gaba
16:51:07 <ma1> and better have a functional forum for some weeks after a major release
16:51:37 <ma1> (sorry for interjecting in a meeting where I was not invited)
16:51:49 <donuts> you have a standing invitation ma1 :)
16:51:50 <gaba> the forum should be functional right after migration.
16:52:04 <donuts> yeah my understanding is that this change is relatively low risk?
16:52:13 <ma1> yeah, I mean better migrating before than after the release
16:52:21 <donuts> right
16:52:45 <donuts> okay I'm happy if everyone else is happy – we'll aim for the 21st onwards for the stable release, after the forum has been migrated
16:53:05 <gaba> ok
16:53:08 <championquizzer> sounds good!
16:53:21 <donuts> thanks for bringing it up championquizzer!
16:54:12 <donuts> okay we only have a few minutes left, any final questions/comments about the release or are we all good?
16:54:25 <donuts> p.s. thank you too richard/gaba/ma1
16:54:40 <ma1> yw & thanks for the invitation :)
16:54:44 <richard> :)
16:55:03 <championquizzer> thanks all! have a good week :)
16:55:20 <donuts> #endmeeting